Afghan shashkas

kwiatek · 22nd November 2019, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahratt

I would be very grateful if someone would help me with the translation.
In my opinion, the scabbard was made specifically for this shashka. Its handle is deeply hidden in the scabbard, which can be seen in the first photo.

Starting with the inscription nearest the throat you have

نصر من الله وفتح قريب

“Victory from God and near conquest” (part of Qur’an 61:13)

الله محمد علي حسن حسين وفاطمة

“God, Muhammad, ‘Ali, Hasan, Husayn and Fatima”

انا فتحنا لك فتحا مبينا

“Indeed we have given you a manifest victory” (Qur’an 48:1)

On the mount in the middle, you have, repeated:

يا قاضي الحاجات

ya qadi al-hajat

“O Requiter of Needs!”

Cthulhu · 5th December 2019, 06:21 PM

I can't see any evidence of drags in the circled photos Mahratt posted, leaving me a little confused on terminology. I know in some cases the term "drag" is used interchangeably with the whole chape. I've edited one of Mahratt's photos to clearly show what I call the drag, distinct from the rest of the chape.

I'll note that at least in the random sampling of European saber photos I looked at, the larger side of the drag always leads, thus providing equal or greater protection to the front side of the chape that's clunking into the ground as you walk. Looking at Mahratt's shasqa sheath, the larger side of the drag is on the concave side, meaning the concave side is downward, matching the orientation of the other mounts. The chape hasn't been removed and reversed, as the carved side and plain side on it match the face and back side (stitched side) of the leather.

All that aside, these are lovely shasqas people have. I really like the shasqa's clean lines and simplicity. I'll have to dig mine out of storage and provide a photo, but it's not in the league of the ones shown here, not by a long shot.

ariel · 6th December 2019, 12:58 AM

Well, if one looks carefully at your delineation of the drag, it is the convex side that seems to be wider, suggesting that the sword was worn “ saber- wise”, not “shashka-wise”. That would prove that the slit on the throat originally was on the upper side, and that the seller intentionally reversed the direction of the suspension fitting to give a false impression that this pseudo shashka was worn like a Caucasian shashka.

The only problem with the drag is that we have no idea whether the sword was worn low ( touching the ground) or not. My guess not: dragging was fashionable among European cavalry officers, just to impress their dancing partners. Afghanis did not care about such niceties:-)

Cthulhu · 6th December 2019, 02:59 AM

My apologies, my post was pretty ambiguous. Instead of "larger" I should have said "longer." The longer side of the drag is in the direction of travel, that is, on the underside, on every European saber where I've looked. I'm assuming this was for the functional reasons I've mentioned, and even if the sword wasn't to be dragged around it would be done in the same way. Of course there's no way to know how a non-European maker would orient the drag. However if we assume these things were done capriciously, we stop being able to say much of anything about anything.

Kubur · 6th December 2019, 03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwiatek

Starting with the inscription nearest the throat you have

“God, Muhammad, ‘Ali, Hasan, Husayn and Fatima”

انا فتحنا لك فتحا مبينا

This guy should have been seriously shi'a...
Persian??

CharlesS · 6th December 2019, 12:36 PM

Thanks so much kwiatek!

kwiatek · 6th December 2019, 09:15 PM

Thank you Kubur and CharlesS for posting your pieces. It‘s great to see new things and to learn!

I think faqir here means “poor” rather than “dervish”, though you’re right that it could have that meaning. It’s quite common for artisans to sign things with a self-deprecating adjective such as “poor” or “humble” or to call themselves “servant” or “slave”.

And yes definitely Shi’i!

ariel · 7th December 2019, 02:35 AM

Yes, Shia.
My guess , this pseudo-shashka was not made in Afghanistan by the local Shia, Hazara or Quizilbash. Afghani-made weapons are usually simple and pretty crude.
I would guess it came from Iran, where there are significant diasporas of both tribes.
Shia Muslims were persecuted in Afghanistan and emigrated in droves. Just to mention wholesale slaughter and displacement of Hazaras by Abdurrahman in the early 1890s: it is claimed that fully half of their population were killed by government forces.
In Iran they settled in Khorasan, a famed arms- manufacturing province. That might explain the sophistication of that sword.

Sakalord364 · 7th January 2024, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Yes, Shia.
My guess , this pseudo-shashka was not made in Afghanistan by the local Shia, Hazara or Quizilbash. Afghani-made weapons are usually simple and pretty crude.
I would guess it came from Iran, where there are significant diasporas of both tribes.
Shia Muslims were persecuted in Afghanistan and emigrated in droves. Just to mention wholesale slaughter and displacement of Hazaras by Abdurrahman in the early 1890s: it is claimed that fully half of their population were killed by government forces.
In Iran they settled in Khorasan, a famed arms- manufacturing province. That might explain the sophistication of that sword.

Just to add a bit, yes the blade is Persian, however the scabbard fittings and Handle is clearly Afghan. This was a trade blade that a local sword cutler used to create an Afghan style Shashka.

In the late 19th century many of these cutlers were Bukharans who settled in Kabul- their main clientele at this point would have been Afghan Army officers who wanted a fancy private purchase sword as opposed to their bland government issued piece.

Turkoman.khan · 7th January 2024, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakalord364

Just to add a bit, yes the blade is Persian, however the scabbard fittings and Handle is clearly Afghan. This was a trade blade that a local sword cutler used to create an Afghan style Shashka.

In the late 19th century many of these cutlers were Bukharans who settled in Kabul- their main clientele at this point would have been Afghan Army officers who wanted a fancy private purchase sword as opposed to their bland government issued piece.

Hello, Sakalord

I don’t think this is the work of Bukhara masters who worked in Kabul. Usually masters from Bukhara used their own techniques for decorating weapons. I recently read the article "Arms decoration features in Khanates of Central Asia":
https://www.academia.edu/105977932/A...Y_20TH_CENTURY

The technique of decorating this shashka is completely different from the techniques used by Bukhara masters.

But I completely agree with your opinion that many Afghan Army officers wanted a fancy private purchase sword.

5th December 2019, 06:21 PM	#2
Cthulhu Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Central Valley, California Posts: 46	What a drag I can't see any evidence of drags in the circled photos Mahratt posted, leaving me a little confused on terminology. I know in some cases the term "drag" is used interchangeably with the whole chape. I've edited one of Mahratt's photos to clearly show what I call the drag, distinct from the rest of the chape. I'll note that at least in the random sampling of European saber photos I looked at, the larger side of the drag always leads, thus providing equal or greater protection to the front side of the chape that's clunking into the ground as you walk. Looking at Mahratt's shasqa sheath, the larger side of the drag is on the concave side, meaning the concave side is downward, matching the orientation of the other mounts. The chape hasn't been removed and reversed, as the carved side and plain side on it match the face and back side (stitched side) of the leather. All that aside, these are lovely shasqas people have. I really like the shasqa's clean lines and simplicity. I'll have to dig mine out of storage and provide a photo, but it's not in the league of the ones shown here, not by a long shot. Attached Images Last edited by Cthulhu; 5th December 2019 at 08:32 PM.

6th December 2019, 12:58 AM	#3
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Well, if one looks carefully at your delineation of the drag, it is the convex side that seems to be wider, suggesting that the sword was worn “ saber- wise”, not “shashka-wise”. That would prove that the slit on the throat originally was on the upper side, and that the seller intentionally reversed the direction of the suspension fitting to give a false impression that this pseudo shashka was worn like a Caucasian shashka. The only problem with the drag is that we have no idea whether the sword was worn low ( touching the ground) or not. My guess not: dragging was fashionable among European cavalry officers, just to impress their dancing partners. Afghanis did not care about such niceties:-)

6th December 2019, 02:59 AM	#4
Cthulhu Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Central Valley, California Posts: 46	My apologies, my post was pretty ambiguous. Instead of "larger" I should have said "longer." The longer side of the drag is in the direction of travel, that is, on the underside, on every European saber where I've looked. I'm assuming this was for the functional reasons I've mentioned, and even if the sword wasn't to be dragged around it would be done in the same way. Of course there's no way to know how a non-European maker would orient the drag. However if we assume these things were done capriciously, we stop being able to say much of anything about anything.

6th December 2019, 12:36 PM	#6
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,855	Thanks so much kwiatek!

6th December 2019, 09:15 PM	#7
kwiatek Member Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 153	Thank you Kubur and CharlesS for posting your pieces. It‘s great to see new things and to learn! I think faqir here means “poor” rather than “dervish”, though you’re right that it could have that meaning. It’s quite common for artisans to sign things with a self-deprecating adjective such as “poor” or “humble” or to call themselves “servant” or “slave”. And yes definitely Shi’i!

7th December 2019, 02:35 AM	#8
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Yes, Shia. My guess , this pseudo-shashka was not made in Afghanistan by the local Shia, Hazara or Quizilbash. Afghani-made weapons are usually simple and pretty crude. I would guess it came from Iran, where there are significant diasporas of both tribes. Shia Muslims were persecuted in Afghanistan and emigrated in droves. Just to mention wholesale slaughter and displacement of Hazaras by Abdurrahman in the early 1890s: it is claimed that fully half of their population were killed by government forces. In Iran they settled in Khorasan, a famed arms- manufacturing province. That might explain the sophistication of that sword.