Sudanese shamshir? anomaly

Jim McDougall · 27th December 2021, 08:11 PM

This is a saber which seems to correspond to Sudanese character with kaskara like langet, but the terminals on the guard of course seem Ottoman. The 'pistol grip 'of bulbous form as with Ottoman kilij/pala.

The diamond cross hatch is similar to these patterns on Darfur kaskara hilts of Ali Dinar period, and there were glass type festoons inserted at one time in each lozenge.

The flared scabbard tip is of course as found on kaskaras, but we see this feature of course on the sabers in Mali. The curved blade swords of takouba form in the Sahara are termed aljuinar, but do not have this feature.

Would appreciate any ideas.

TVV · 27th December 2021, 10:24 PM

Very interesting find Jim, thank you for sharing. To me it does indeed look like a Sudanese interpretation of a shamshir with an Ottoman style hilt. We know such swords were quite popular in Egypt prior Muhammad Ali's destruction of the mamelukes in 1811. Some of the mamelukes in fact escaped South to Dongola, with the sultan of Sennar helpless to do much about them until they were finally wiped out in Muhammad Ali's conquest of Sudan. These mamelukes certainly brought a good number of swords with them, so there would have been examples for local artisans to copy. Alternatively, Muhammad Ali's invasion force consisted mostly of Turks and Albanians from the original army with which he went to Egypt, and many must have carried Ottoman hilted shamshirs with them as well. It is not hard to imagine a situation in which a shamshir blade needed new fittings and local craftsmen did their best to copy the original hilt form, while decorating in their own way.

Battara · 27th December 2021, 11:53 PM

I love the repousse work on the hilt and scabbard mounts. Nicely done. Not used to seeing this quality of work on Sudanese pieces.

Edster · 28th December 2021, 02:20 AM

Interesting sword, Jim. The heptagram (7-pointed star on the pommel is unique for me. It has symbolic meaning in all three Abrahamic religions as per Wiki below:
"*The heptagram was used in Christianity to symbolize the seven days of creation and became a traditional symbol for warding off evil. The symbol is used in some Christian branches such as Catholicism and Orthodox Christianity.
*The symbol is also used in Kabbalist Judaism.
*In Islam, the heptagram is used to represent the first seven verses in the Quran."

The blade looks flat with no details as if it may be sheet metal; surely not.

Best,
Ed

Jim McDougall · 28th December 2021, 02:26 AM

Thanks very much guys! I've had this for a very long time, but never adequately researched it. The blade I think someone said was Turkish 'bayez'? or some such form of Ottoman watered steel...I am a complete neanderthal at metallurgy, so cannot recall and cannot get more images of blade yet.

Teodor, spot on with the Mamluks into Sennar, and while they were effectively ended in degree by the Egyptian sultan, the Mamluk culture through descendants prevailed there as traders and artisans. I think this is where the notable convention of thuluth on blades and metalwork came from in the Caliphate before Omdurman as this was a Mamluk tradition.

As far as I have known, this is the only example of this kind of Sudanese 'saber', and would be thrilled to know of any other examples or supporting literature.
We know that Tuaregs who were of course keen on broadswords, did have curved blade sabers termed aljuinar (per Lee Jones )but this seems compellingly Sudanese.

Jim McDougall · 28th December 2021, 02:30 AM

Thanks Ed, we crossed posts. No it is definitely not sheet, and there is some sort of activity in the steel. I will try to get pics, but as I note, when it was examined some years ago it was noted as some form of Turkish pattern.

Thank you for the info on the heptagram. This type of star has also been seen on the hilts of some Murid shashkas from Daghestan and Chechnya.

Edster · 28th December 2021, 11:20 PM

Jim,

I looked at the Summary of Historical Notes portion of my Kaskara Crossguards paper and found a couple of saber use notes.
1. 1700-1702 Father Krump observed sabers used by Funj horse & camel cavalry.
2. In a version of the Notes I found El Tounsy's "Voyage to Wadai" (1851) an observation that only the Sultan can use a scimitar and that sabres were imported from Fezzan (now Libya), but soldiers used swords. He also notes the leaf shaped scabbard of the Mandinka were used there. This full text didn't get into the final essay version.

It seems that complete swords and saber were imported in the early 1700s and sabers were only used by the elite. By 1800 sword blades were being imported from Germany and over time replaces the saber even among the elite. Sabers still in use in Wadai area as imports came from Libya rather than Cairo for the Nile Valley.

This may suggest that your saber originated in Wadai/Darfur area.

Best,
Ed

27th December 2021, 08:11 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,762	Sudanese shamshir? anomaly This is a saber which seems to correspond to Sudanese character with kaskara like langet, but the terminals on the guard of course seem Ottoman. The 'pistol grip 'of bulbous form as with Ottoman kilij/pala. The diamond cross hatch is similar to these patterns on Darfur kaskara hilts of Ali Dinar period, and there were glass type festoons inserted at one time in each lozenge. The flared scabbard tip is of course as found on kaskaras, but we see this feature of course on the sabers in Mali. The curved blade swords of takouba form in the Sahara are termed aljuinar, but do not have this feature. Would appreciate any ideas. Attached Images

27th December 2021, 10:24 PM	#2
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,599	Very interesting find Jim, thank you for sharing. To me it does indeed look like a Sudanese interpretation of a shamshir with an Ottoman style hilt. We know such swords were quite popular in Egypt prior Muhammad Ali's destruction of the mamelukes in 1811. Some of the mamelukes in fact escaped South to Dongola, with the sultan of Sennar helpless to do much about them until they were finally wiped out in Muhammad Ali's conquest of Sudan. These mamelukes certainly brought a good number of swords with them, so there would have been examples for local artisans to copy. Alternatively, Muhammad Ali's invasion force consisted mostly of Turks and Albanians from the original army with which he went to Egypt, and many must have carried Ottoman hilted shamshirs with them as well. It is not hard to imagine a situation in which a shamshir blade needed new fittings and local craftsmen did their best to copy the original hilt form, while decorating in their own way.

27th December 2021, 11:53 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	I love the repousse work on the hilt and scabbard mounts. Nicely done. Not used to seeing this quality of work on Sudanese pieces.

28th December 2021, 02:20 AM	#4
Edster Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 392	Interesting sword, Jim. The heptagram (7-pointed star on the pommel is unique for me. It has symbolic meaning in all three Abrahamic religions as per Wiki below: "The heptagram was used in Christianity to symbolize the seven days of creation and became a traditional symbol for warding off evil. The symbol is used in some Christian branches such as Catholicism and Orthodox Christianity. The symbol is also used in Kabbalist Judaism. *In Islam, the heptagram is used to represent the first seven verses in the Quran." The blade looks flat with no details as if it may be sheet metal; surely not. Best, Ed

28th December 2021, 02:26 AM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,762	Thanks very much guys! I've had this for a very long time, but never adequately researched it. The blade I think someone said was Turkish 'bayez'? or some such form of Ottoman watered steel...I am a complete neanderthal at metallurgy, so cannot recall and cannot get more images of blade yet. Teodor, spot on with the Mamluks into Sennar, and while they were effectively ended in degree by the Egyptian sultan, the Mamluk culture through descendants prevailed there as traders and artisans. I think this is where the notable convention of thuluth on blades and metalwork came from in the Caliphate before Omdurman as this was a Mamluk tradition. As far as I have known, this is the only example of this kind of Sudanese 'saber', and would be thrilled to know of any other examples or supporting literature. We know that Tuaregs who were of course keen on broadswords, did have curved blade sabers termed aljuinar (per Lee Jones )but this seems compellingly Sudanese.

28th December 2021, 02:30 AM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,762	Thanks Ed, we crossed posts. No it is definitely not sheet, and there is some sort of activity in the steel. I will try to get pics, but as I note, when it was examined some years ago it was noted as some form of Turkish pattern. Thank you for the info on the heptagram. This type of star has also been seen on the hilts of some Murid shashkas from Daghestan and Chechnya.

28th December 2021, 11:20 PM	#7
Edster Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 392	Jim, I looked at the Summary of Historical Notes portion of my Kaskara Crossguards paper and found a couple of saber use notes. 1. 1700-1702 Father Krump observed sabers used by Funj horse & camel cavalry. 2. In a version of the Notes I found El Tounsy's "Voyage to Wadai" (1851) an observation that only the Sultan can use a scimitar and that sabres were imported from Fezzan (now Libya), but soldiers used swords. He also notes the leaf shaped scabbard of the Mandinka were used there. This full text didn't get into the final essay version. It seems that complete swords and saber were imported in the early 1700s and sabers were only used by the elite. By 1800 sword blades were being imported from Germany and over time replaces the saber even among the elite. Sabers still in use in Wadai area as imports came from Libya rather than Cairo for the Nile Valley. This may suggest that your saber originated in Wadai/Darfur area. Best, Ed