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Old 21st November 2017, 11:24 PM   #1
Madnumforce
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Default Identifying an unknown, probably Austrian hanger

Hello,

This is probably my first post, but I badly need your knowledge to help me identify a rather peculiar (to me) short saber I bought at a flea market. The hilt really looks like that of the Austrian 1837 pattern, except it doesn't have the "ears" on the sides of the ricasso, but the blade doesn't seem to fit any type. I've looked around for the markings, and barely legible one seems to be a two-headed eagle, and the only clue I could find about the GF was that it could have been the mark of the Gewehrfabrik, in the Vienna arsenal, operating till 1852. The pictures aren't of excellent quality, but I think they're enough to still make the saber recognizable.

Who the hell would have carried what's basically a briquet-sized saber?
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Last edited by fernando : 22nd November 2017 at 02:30 PM.
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Old 22nd November 2017, 02:37 PM   #2
fernando
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Default To bear in mind ...

Welcome to the forum, Madnumforce.
First thing you missed in our rules is that posting pictures supported by host links is not an adequate procedure.
I have saved your images to my hard disk and uploaded them with the proper atachment features.
Let us see what the members have to say about your sword.

.
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Old 22nd November 2017, 05:47 PM   #3
iod1889
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Hello,

Based on Christian Ortner and Erich Artlieb gorgeous book "With Drawn Sword - Austro-Hungarian Edged Weapons 1848-1918", this seems to be an Infantry troop's saber 1851 model. (also called 18363-1851 model)

The total length of the example they presented is 823mm and its weight 958 g

As far as the GF is concerned, I cannot find any certain reference, but they mention Fischer as a firm which created many sabers for the army.

They were used by Line infantry, Grenadiers, Fusiliers, Grenz-infanterie, reserve, etc ...

I heartily recommend the book ;-)

Regards,

Benoit
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Old 22nd November 2017, 09:43 PM   #4
Madnumforce
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Hello Fernando and Benoît,

First, sorry for not having used the proper procedure for posting pictures. This will not happen in the future.

Second, thank you very much for the identification! But Searching on the web for the difference between the 1836 and 1851 pattern I don't see much at first glance. Does the book give any precision on that regard?
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Old 23rd November 2017, 12:09 PM   #5
fernando
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madnumforce
...First, sorry for not having used the proper procedure for posting pictures. This will not happen in the future...

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Old 23rd November 2017, 06:00 PM   #6
iod1889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madnumforce
Hello Fernando and Benoît,
Second, thank you very much for the identification! But Searching on the web for the difference between the 1836 and 1851 pattern I don't see much at first glance. Does the book give any precision on that regard?


Hello again,

Internet is great to interact, but books are still a valuable resource !!

I shall quote the book "This was basically the M1836 sabre with a few alterations : The back-piece was to be stepped instead of rounded and the knuckle guard was to be altered so that the upper part curved outwards even more. The crosspiece was also altered in that where, in the M1836, it had joined directly with the knuckle guard, there was now a small extension to prevent the sword knot or portepee from slipping"

I must admit that I do not understand the part about the back-piece and photos do not help me much.

Yet the joining of the crosspiece with the knuckle guard is characteristic. On the 1836, it just looks as if the crosspiece was just bent at a right angle to become the knuckle guard. On your example, you can clearly see both the 'external' extension and the 'internal' addition which strengthens the link.

regards,

Benoit

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