Ottoman Balkan Miquelet muskets

Cerjak · 22nd August 2016, 10:35 AM

Ottoman Balkan Miquelet muskets
Two nice examples of Ottoman Balkan Miquelet 'Boyliya' musket with mother of pearl and micromosaic inlay and one Ottoman Turkish Tufek Musket.
These 3 muskets had been already discussed but the previous photos were of poor quality it ‘s why today I post this new set of pictures.
Any comment on it will be welcome.
Best
Cerjak

Cerjak · 22nd August 2016, 10:51 AM

more pics

Kubur · 22nd August 2016, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cerjak

more pics

Hi Cerjak,

I'm sure that you have seen the name of the gunmaker and the date.
They are yours??
Are you sure that you need two Boyliya?

Cerjak · 22nd August 2016, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi Cerjak,

I'm sure that you have seen the name of the gunmaker and the date.
Hi Kubur,
Yes Kubur Atlanta and Dom already did this job.
They are yours??
yes of course
Are you sure that you need two Boyliya?
yes you are right I need more than 2 !

rickystl · 27th August 2016, 03:56 PM

Hi Cerjak.

Thank you for posting these updated photos. Those Boyliyas are beautiful. And in very nice condition. Even with a slight variation in decoration, you can see the general pattern for the Boyliya being very similar. And notice the butt stocks made in two pieces. I remember in the earlier posts discussing the diiferent theories for the two-piece butt stocks on many Ottoman style guns.

I notice this Tufuk musket has the extra short butt stock, but a full length barrel. Some thought these guns originally had longer butt stocks that may have been damaged and repaired leaving it short, requiring it to be shot from the cheek, Japanese matchlock style. But I've never thought this to be true. I've seen too many examples of the Tufuk made this way. Still not sure why.

Anyway, very nice pieces ALL !!! I still do not have a Boyliya in my collection.

Rick

Oliver Pinchot · 27th August 2016, 04:28 PM

The tufek is absolutely missing the butt.

qusko · 1st March 2020, 07:22 AM

Adding images of long Balkan musket. It's very similar to long boyliya rifles but with Albanian lock. Do you have some suggestions about more detailed origin?

Barrel stamped with M in crown.

rickystl · 8th March 2020, 07:59 PM

Hello ALL.

Glad this Thread was bumped forward from a couple years ago with part of the discussion about the excessively short butt stocks you see on some of the Ottoman long guns. And to whether or not the short butt stocks were made this way, or if they originally had a longer section of wood making them true shoulder length. I've never really believed they were originally made short. The added butt caps weather bone, brass, etc.I believe are a 20th Century addition to cover up for a missing butt section.
Notice the tufek I posted above with the short butt stock with a brass plate nailed on the end. I planed on making this gun into a shooter, and did so by adding a new steel liner inside the original barrel, new front sight, tuned lock, etc. But I just couldn't phantom shooting this gun with the short butt stock.
So I got in touch with fellow Forum member Philip Tom and asked if he would be interested in the project of adding a new butt section as per the original. Fortunately for me Philip responded in the positive. During this restoration it would also answer the question as to weather there was originally a longer butt section when the gun was originally built. Sure enough, once Philip removed the brass butt cap the evidence was there with holes in the stock showing that the gun had an original longer section.
I sent Philip the gun stock and a big chunk of European walnut (actually two pieces glued together). Philip did a masterful job restoring the butt stock. Could not have been an easy job with the unusual shape of Ottoman rear butt sections. But the job turned out just great. (THANK YOU PHILIP!!) Here are some updated pics of the now finished, and ready to shoot Tufek. Still a bit of an ugly duck with that sliver of wood missing from the right, rear fore stock. But noting I can do about that. Still happy with the outcome.

Rick

Kubur · 8th March 2020, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickystl

I've never really believed they were originally made short. The added butt caps weather bone, brass, etc.I believe are a 20th Century addition to cover up for a missing butt section.

Sure enough, once Philip removed the brass butt cap the evidence was there with holes in the stock showing that the gun had an original longer section.

Rick

Philip's work is wonderful.
But this time I disagree with you Rick.
Many Ottoman guns had very short butts, not even in Museums but also on old engravings.
Then the holes that you found don't prove that your gun had a long butt but it just proves that a but plate was missing, maybe wood, ivory or other...

All the best,
Kubur

Kubur · 8th March 2020, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qusko

Adding images of long Balkan musket. It's very similar to long boyliya rifles but with Albanian lock. Do you have some suggestions about more detailed origin?

Barrel stamped with M in crown.

More I look at your gun, more I think that you are right the wooden stock is from a Boliya or Bulgarian style, the lock is Albanian and all the decoration is Ottoman Turkish.
I have a book on Ottoman Bulgarian weapons I will try to find it.
So your gun should be from the borders in between Bulgaria and Turkey or even all the pieces were brought to modern days Turkey. And then the gun was mounted there.
The barrel should be Italian but I don't recognise this face.

22nd August 2016, 10:35 AM	#1
Cerjak Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: FRANCE Posts: 1,064	Ottoman Balkan Miquelet muskets Ottoman Balkan Miquelet muskets Two nice examples of Ottoman Balkan Miquelet 'Boyliya' musket with mother of pearl and micromosaic inlay and one Ottoman Turkish Tufek Musket. These 3 muskets had been already discussed but the previous photos were of poor quality it ‘s why today I post this new set of pictures. Any comment on it will be welcome. Best Cerjak Attached Images Last edited by Cerjak; 22nd August 2016 at 10:46 AM.

22nd August 2016, 10:51 AM	#2
Cerjak Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: FRANCE Posts: 1,064	more pics more pics Attached Images

1st March 2020, 07:22 AM	#7
qusko Member Join Date: Nov 2018 Posts: 43	Similar to Bulgarian Boyliya but with Albanian lock Adding images of long Balkan musket. It's very similar to long boyliya rifles but with Albanian lock. Do you have some suggestions about more detailed origin? Barrel stamped with M in crown. Attached Images

8th March 2020, 07:59 PM	#8
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,621	Hello ALL. Glad this Thread was bumped forward from a couple years ago with part of the discussion about the excessively short butt stocks you see on some of the Ottoman long guns. And to whether or not the short butt stocks were made this way, or if they originally had a longer section of wood making them true shoulder length. I've never really believed they were originally made short. The added butt caps weather bone, brass, etc.I believe are a 20th Century addition to cover up for a missing butt section. Notice the tufek I posted above with the short butt stock with a brass plate nailed on the end. I planed on making this gun into a shooter, and did so by adding a new steel liner inside the original barrel, new front sight, tuned lock, etc. But I just couldn't phantom shooting this gun with the short butt stock. So I got in touch with fellow Forum member Philip Tom and asked if he would be interested in the project of adding a new butt section as per the original. Fortunately for me Philip responded in the positive. During this restoration it would also answer the question as to weather there was originally a longer butt section when the gun was originally built. Sure enough, once Philip removed the brass butt cap the evidence was there with holes in the stock showing that the gun had an original longer section. I sent Philip the gun stock and a big chunk of European walnut (actually two pieces glued together). Philip did a masterful job restoring the butt stock. Could not have been an easy job with the unusual shape of Ottoman rear butt sections. But the job turned out just great. (THANK YOU PHILIP!!) Here are some updated pics of the now finished, and ready to shoot Tufek. Still a bit of an ugly duck with that sliver of wood missing from the right, rear fore stock. But noting I can do about that. Still happy with the outcome. Rick Attached Images

27th August 2016, 03:56 PM	#5
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,621	Hi Cerjak. Thank you for posting these updated photos. Those Boyliyas are beautiful. And in very nice condition. Even with a slight variation in decoration, you can see the general pattern for the Boyliya being very similar. And notice the butt stocks made in two pieces. I remember in the earlier posts discussing the diiferent theories for the two-piece butt stocks on many Ottoman style guns. I notice this Tufuk musket has the extra short butt stock, but a full length barrel. Some thought these guns originally had longer butt stocks that may have been damaged and repaired leaving it short, requiring it to be shot from the cheek, Japanese matchlock style. But I've never thought this to be true. I've seen too many examples of the Tufuk made this way. Still not sure why. Anyway, very nice pieces ALL !!! I still do not have a Boyliya in my collection. Rick

27th August 2016, 04:28 PM	#6
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 456	The tufek is absolutely missing the butt.