Why Post?

Jim McDougall · 24th June 2009, 10:21 PM

I often notice the number of views on threads vs. the number of posts, and that in many cases, posts are placed almost apologetically, as if the information being shared is somehow inadequate.

This is emphatically NOT the case.

As most here know, I have written on these forums for many years, and it is also well known that I am seldom brief. I know that many perceive my writing in different ways, anywhere from erudition (not) to thoughts these are hyperinflated 'pronouncements' , and thankfully to those of you who have kindly acknowledged my work as worthwhile and helpful information. This is how it has always been intended. I enjoy spending hours and often longer in pursuing answers to discussions and questions at hand, not necessarily to prove I am overly knowledgable, but to learn. I typically dont know the material at the outset, but simply use whatever resources I can to put together material which I very much enjoy sharing. I always look forward to being corrected as well, as I know that no matter how intensely I research something, misperception or errors, even inadvertant omissions are inevitable. I cannot possibly describe how much I have learned from the many well supported opposing views and rebuttals to gentle corrections I have experienced through the years.

What I have always considered the wonder of these forums is those who consistantly write and share thier knowledge, mostly from experience in handling actual examples and specializing in certain fields. Many collect and study a number of weapon forms, many are entirely eclectic, but regardless often deeply engage in learning about the items they acquire. Some study esoteric areas that few specialize in, and openly share new arrivals. The postings of various museums and thier holdings are wonderful, as those of us who may never reach those places have the opportunity to enjoy and admire them.

As always, I am so profoundly grateful to all of you here who are constantly on the threads, and sharing your amazing collections and knowledge. For me personally it is fantastic as an expatriate collector to be able to vicariously experience the wonderful arms and armour shared here. As an always obsessed researcher I always look forward to discussions and bringing in new material. My writing consists only of study of information available as I have no weapons or collection at hand, only the books and notes that travel with me.

For those of you out there reading, and I know there are many, as you read the threads and posts, please join in, ask questions, share any information you can, no matter how inconsequential you think it might be. The idea is to share thoughts,ideas, observations, opinions . These forums are entirely global, and we need to know of resources in many languages and countries.

My hope is that this will serve not only as a most sincere thank you to all of the members and staff who have done so much to make our forums successful, but as an invitation for the readers out there to come in with us.
These threads are intended to stand as archived material to benefit collectors, scholars and anyone involved with arms and armour, and to encourage participation in advancing the study of them.

With all very best regards,
Jim

VANDOO · 25th June 2009, 12:22 AM

THE KNOWLEGE SHARED HERE IS FOR THE GAIN OF ALL NOT THE GAIN OF THE ONE.
WHEN SOMEONE POSTS AND GETS NO ANSWER VERY SOON HE WILL THINK HE IS ALONE AND NO ONE IS INTERESTED AND MOVE ON. THE NUMBER OF VIEWS DOSEN'T COUNT IT IS THE NUMBER OF REPLYS THAT MATTER. TRY TO BE MORE ORIGINAL THAN =NICE ONE, COOL, NEAT OR PITTIFUL! ONE WORD REPLYS DON'T COUNT. IF YOU CAN'T ADD TO THE INFORMATION OR THINK OF A COMMENT ASK A QUESTION SUCH AS WHAT ARE THE MATERIALS USED OR MEASUREMENTS OR WHERE THEY FOUND IT AND IF THERE WERE ANY STORIES FROM THE SELLER.
JIM IS A DEDICATED SCHOLAR AND CAREFULLY RESEARCHES BEFORE HE POSTS AND CAN BACK UP WHAT HE SAYS WITH REFRENCES.
I ON THE OTHER HAND OFTEN DRAW ON OLD MEMORIES OF THINGS I SAW OR LEARNED FROM THE OLD TIMERS OR BOOKS OR LACKING THAT USE CONJECTURE, LOGIC AND GUESSES OR ASK QUESTIONS JUST TO LET THE POSTER KNOW I WAS THERE. I SELDOM HAVE THE TIME OR INCLINATION TO GO LOOKING FOR THE NEEDLE IN THE HAYSTACK ESPECIALLY WHEN I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHERE THE HAYSTACK IS.

HAYSTACK= REFRENCE
SO FAR I HAVEN'T BEEN BURNED AT THE STAKE

I THINK CONJECTURE AND GUESSES, THOUGH JUST MY OPINION FORMED FROM FACTS I HAVE ENCOUNTERED OVER THE YEARS IS MUCH BETTER THAN NO REPLY. IT OFTEN ELICITS REPLYS FROM OTHERS MORE KNOWLEGABLE.
THESE FORUMS ARE A DATA BASE AND THOSE WHO CHECK IT FOR INFORMATION WILL RETURN REGULARLY IF NEW INFORMATION IS ADDED. IF THEY ALWAYS FIND THE SAME INFORMATION EVERY TIME THEY WILL MOVE ON AND VISIT SELDOM OR NOT AT ALL. IF THAT HAPPENS THE FORUM BECOMES DEAD LIKE A DUSTY REFRENCE BOOK IN A LIBRARY SOMEWHERE.
I PREFER A LIVE AND LIVELY FORUM

fearn · 25th June 2009, 12:52 AM

Useful four word answer:

Question: Is this a [insert name here]?

Answer: No, it's a [insert name here].

To me, this is a discussion. Sometimes you're long-winded, sometimes terse. Either way is okay.

As for page views: I can think of one discussion (not saying which one either!) that I very carefully saved off-line, even though I didn't post on it. The reason was that the pictures were amazing, and were a really good reference.

It's a discussion. Sometimes the people who are lurking are getting more out of it than the ones who are participating. Simply reading these posts is a great way to learn.

That said, I do like the Encyclopaedia McDougalliana, and I always look forward to reading the newest entries.

Best,

F

kahnjar1 · 25th June 2009, 06:01 AM

Interesting that this subject should come up now, have been having some email contact with a Forum member over another matter, and the comment was passed about the apparent lack of replies to their posts. Are we becoming too apathetic, or is it just a lack of interest in other members collecting field? Personally I find the "other" interests a great learning experience. In my opinion it can become very boring if one only concentrates on their ones items, and not take an interest in what others collect.
Jim--You could maybe answer to one of the observations made, as I don't know the answer. Does the view count only include members, or does it also include "outside surfers"? If this IS the case, it may explain why the number of views way exceeds the replies.
Regards Stuart

Atlantia · 25th June 2009, 01:13 PM

This is an interesting point.
Now obviously there are different 'layers' to the posts and threads on this site, there are the academic study of the high end pieces, which is great and for many of us it's nice to dream....
But then there are also the 'masses' myself included who range from those literally just starting out, general collectors, people who want information on a 'single piece' etc...
Speaking for myself, if I post a picture of a new item I've acquired, I want lots of comments! Yes I hope that amongst the replys someone like Jim will post, as his posts are always overflowing with facts, ideas, and enthusiasm for the field. But I do also realise that we can't always expect the scholarly members to reply in every thread and although I consider those members to be the 'cornerstones' of the site, I'd like to think that the rest of 'us' are the mortar that holds it all together.
Collecting shouldn't be a solitary pursuit, sharing a find with ones friends is an important part of it for me.
I for one, am far happier to get a few short replys to a post from my friends on these forums congratulating me for adding to my collection in these hard times, than when I post and see hundreds of views and nobody bothers to even say 'nice find mate'.
By the same token, I hope that when I can't add anything more than my enthusiasm and congratulations to a thread but still want to show solidarity with one of you, I hope you are not offended or thinking 'spam'.
IMHO there are no bad posts that are well intentioned. The only sad thing is seeing a '0' under replies.

Regards
Gene

Jim McDougall · 25th June 2009, 04:47 PM

Excellent responses here guys! As always I thank you all for the kindnesses toward my efforts, and recognizing the very deep passion I do have for the study of arms. It has been a lifelong passion that long exceeded my once concurrent passion for collecting. I only gave up the collecting in response to profound life events changing the means required to continue the hobby, not my interest in it. As I mentioned, it is wonderful that all of you so openly share your latest conquests and items in your collections, and I am able to vicariously enjoy them as well as continuing my research, which in kind, I enjoy sharing here.

It is wonderful to see the beautifully crafted responses that you have posted here Vandoo, Fearn, Khanjar and Fearn (I know your real names, but use pen names for the benefit of the readers), and these are well thought out and worded, distinctly reflecting your own styles of writing and your distinct personalities.

Your comments are all well placed, and have genuinely brought to my attention perspective I honestly had not thought of, and very much liked Atlantia's analogy of cornerstones and mortar! I agree that there are many variations to degree of response afforded to various posts, and often in proportion to each individuals familiarity or interest in a piece shared. That is well understood, and I admit that myself I often defer comment on the many topics I have limited resources or knowledge on, a broad range indeed, but honestly try to find something to say by searching as much as I can that I might try to say something.
As noted, I find it very sad to see a post standing with 0 responses.

What always impresses me is that there is indeed a great deal of solidarity here, and it is always a pleasure to see such gentlemanly behaviour even in the presence of obvious disagreement. I do admire the fact that everyone does come in with even kind comments that are 'brief' but complimentary when a new acquisition is posted.

What I am saying is addressed to the many readers out there who are clearly present in considerable numbers and that thier input is welcomed.Despite the amount and depth of knowledge being imparted in these threads, it does not diminish the inclusion of the same kind of pleasant comment noted or well placed questions by newcomers or readers. We know you are out there, and we want to know what you think or what questions you might have.

As I have always emphasized, it is how we all learn..together! We share thoughts , ideas, questions, and observations without reservation.

I would again emphasize my deep gratitude to everyone here who does participate, and in whatever degree, and always admire the contributions in text from which I honestly believe we have all learned a great deal. With reference to the excellent analogy of cornerstones, and mortar....not forgetting the solidarity of the stones, I believe we all stand together as a sort of venerable bastion for the advancement of the study of historic arms and armour.

Thank you again everyone!

All very best regards,
Jim

Norman McCormick · 25th June 2009, 06:11 PM

Hi,
This is indeed an interesting and sometime difficult subject. As diverse as the subjects on the Forum so it is with the Members who participate, some may feel comfortable with one kind of approach whilst others do not. The dilemma of being really interested but judging whether to risk putting ones big foot in it while on the other hand not wanting to appear disinterested can be problematic, well, for me at least! Not all members have the same 'drive' or ambitions for their collections and it is important to include the curious as well as the enthusiast. I really feel for members, and it is normally newer ones, who, after putting out their hard earned cash, and it is really hard earned for some these days, on a piece find to their dismay that the 'gold' they have dug up is in actual fact 'mud'. I do think on these occasions that a 'diplomatic' and courteous let down is an absolute positive in getting these newer members to 'post and answer' in future and not to be left intimidated by their confusion or lack of knowledge, we all have lack of knowledge in many other spheres. This 'ignorance' can be the root of an unwillingness to reply to posts but is not to be confused with the 'ignorant', a situation which unfortunately a good member thought himself the subject of recently, re ignore list. I do not know of any members on this Forum who are disposed to be dismissive with regard to others ' buying mistakes' and lack of knowledge, we've all been there, in actual fact I have seen several very tactful let downs and corrections but I have seen the opposite on many other forums, sometimes it is the little green god at work, and it doesn't take too long for a clique to form and ruin it for others. I think proactive tolerance, courtesy and a willingness to illuminate, which I must say is very evident on this Forum and certainly lacking in some others, will go a long way in encouraging the less knowledgeable members, and I include myself in that merry band, joining in discussions. I sincerely hope that no Member will take any of the foregoing personally as this is not my intention it is simply observations I have made when comparing similar forums.
My Regards,
Norman.

24th June 2009, 10:21 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,739	Why Post? I often notice the number of views on threads vs. the number of posts, and that in many cases, posts are placed almost apologetically, as if the information being shared is somehow inadequate. This is emphatically NOT the case. As most here know, I have written on these forums for many years, and it is also well known that I am seldom brief. I know that many perceive my writing in different ways, anywhere from erudition (not) to thoughts these are hyperinflated 'pronouncements' , and thankfully to those of you who have kindly acknowledged my work as worthwhile and helpful information. This is how it has always been intended. I enjoy spending hours and often longer in pursuing answers to discussions and questions at hand, not necessarily to prove I am overly knowledgable, but to learn. I typically dont know the material at the outset, but simply use whatever resources I can to put together material which I very much enjoy sharing. I always look forward to being corrected as well, as I know that no matter how intensely I research something, misperception or errors, even inadvertant omissions are inevitable. I cannot possibly describe how much I have learned from the many well supported opposing views and rebuttals to gentle corrections I have experienced through the years. What I have always considered the wonder of these forums is those who consistantly write and share thier knowledge, mostly from experience in handling actual examples and specializing in certain fields. Many collect and study a number of weapon forms, many are entirely eclectic, but regardless often deeply engage in learning about the items they acquire. Some study esoteric areas that few specialize in, and openly share new arrivals. The postings of various museums and thier holdings are wonderful, as those of us who may never reach those places have the opportunity to enjoy and admire them. As always, I am so profoundly grateful to all of you here who are constantly on the threads, and sharing your amazing collections and knowledge. For me personally it is fantastic as an expatriate collector to be able to vicariously experience the wonderful arms and armour shared here. As an always obsessed researcher I always look forward to discussions and bringing in new material. My writing consists only of study of information available as I have no weapons or collection at hand, only the books and notes that travel with me. For those of you out there reading, and I know there are many, as you read the threads and posts, please join in, ask questions, share any information you can, no matter how inconsequential you think it might be. The idea is to share thoughts,ideas, observations, opinions . These forums are entirely global, and we need to know of resources in many languages and countries. My hope is that this will serve not only as a most sincere thank you to all of the members and staff who have done so much to make our forums successful, but as an invitation for the readers out there to come in with us. These threads are intended to stand as archived material to benefit collectors, scholars and anyone involved with arms and armour, and to encourage participation in advancing the study of them. With all very best regards, Jim Last edited by Jim McDougall; 25th June 2009 at 12:31 AM.

25th June 2009, 12:22 AM	#2
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THE KNOWLEGE SHARED HERE IS FOR THE GAIN OF ALL NOT THE GAIN OF THE ONE. WHEN SOMEONE POSTS AND GETS NO ANSWER VERY SOON HE WILL THINK HE IS ALONE AND NO ONE IS INTERESTED AND MOVE ON. THE NUMBER OF VIEWS DOSEN'T COUNT IT IS THE NUMBER OF REPLYS THAT MATTER. TRY TO BE MORE ORIGINAL THAN =NICE ONE, COOL, NEAT OR PITTIFUL! ONE WORD REPLYS DON'T COUNT. IF YOU CAN'T ADD TO THE INFORMATION OR THINK OF A COMMENT ASK A QUESTION SUCH AS WHAT ARE THE MATERIALS USED OR MEASUREMENTS OR WHERE THEY FOUND IT AND IF THERE WERE ANY STORIES FROM THE SELLER. JIM IS A DEDICATED SCHOLAR AND CAREFULLY RESEARCHES BEFORE HE POSTS AND CAN BACK UP WHAT HE SAYS WITH REFRENCES. I ON THE OTHER HAND OFTEN DRAW ON OLD MEMORIES OF THINGS I SAW OR LEARNED FROM THE OLD TIMERS OR BOOKS OR LACKING THAT USE CONJECTURE, LOGIC AND GUESSES OR ASK QUESTIONS JUST TO LET THE POSTER KNOW I WAS THERE. I SELDOM HAVE THE TIME OR INCLINATION TO GO LOOKING FOR THE NEEDLE IN THE HAYSTACK ESPECIALLY WHEN I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHERE THE HAYSTACK IS. HAYSTACK= REFRENCE SO FAR I HAVEN'T BEEN BURNED AT THE STAKE I THINK CONJECTURE AND GUESSES, THOUGH JUST MY OPINION FORMED FROM FACTS I HAVE ENCOUNTERED OVER THE YEARS IS MUCH BETTER THAN NO REPLY. IT OFTEN ELICITS REPLYS FROM OTHERS MORE KNOWLEGABLE. THESE FORUMS ARE A DATA BASE AND THOSE WHO CHECK IT FOR INFORMATION WILL RETURN REGULARLY IF NEW INFORMATION IS ADDED. IF THEY ALWAYS FIND THE SAME INFORMATION EVERY TIME THEY WILL MOVE ON AND VISIT SELDOM OR NOT AT ALL. IF THAT HAPPENS THE FORUM BECOMES DEAD LIKE A DUSTY REFRENCE BOOK IN A LIBRARY SOMEWHERE. I PREFER A LIVE AND LIVELY FORUM

25th June 2009, 12:52 AM	#3
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Useful four word answer: Question: Is this a [insert name here]? Answer: No, it's a [insert name here]. To me, this is a discussion. Sometimes you're long-winded, sometimes terse. Either way is okay. As for page views: I can think of one discussion (not saying which one either!) that I very carefully saved off-line, even though I didn't post on it. The reason was that the pictures were amazing, and were a really good reference. It's a discussion. Sometimes the people who are lurking are getting more out of it than the ones who are participating. Simply reading these posts is a great way to learn. That said, I do like the Encyclopaedia McDougalliana, and I always look forward to reading the newest entries. Best, F

25th June 2009, 06:01 AM	#4
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,729	Interesting that this subject should come up now, have been having some email contact with a Forum member over another matter, and the comment was passed about the apparent lack of replies to their posts. Are we becoming too apathetic, or is it just a lack of interest in other members collecting field? Personally I find the "other" interests a great learning experience. In my opinion it can become very boring if one only concentrates on their ones items, and not take an interest in what others collect. Jim--You could maybe answer to one of the observations made, as I don't know the answer. Does the view count only include members, or does it also include "outside surfers"? If this IS the case, it may explain why the number of views way exceeds the replies. Regards Stuart

25th June 2009, 01:13 PM	#5
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	This is an interesting point. Now obviously there are different 'layers' to the posts and threads on this site, there are the academic study of the high end pieces, which is great and for many of us it's nice to dream.... But then there are also the 'masses' myself included who range from those literally just starting out, general collectors, people who want information on a 'single piece' etc... Speaking for myself, if I post a picture of a new item I've acquired, I want lots of comments! Yes I hope that amongst the replys someone like Jim will post, as his posts are always overflowing with facts, ideas, and enthusiasm for the field. But I do also realise that we can't always expect the scholarly members to reply in every thread and although I consider those members to be the 'cornerstones' of the site, I'd like to think that the rest of 'us' are the mortar that holds it all together. Collecting shouldn't be a solitary pursuit, sharing a find with ones friends is an important part of it for me. I for one, am far happier to get a few short replys to a post from my friends on these forums congratulating me for adding to my collection in these hard times, than when I post and see hundreds of views and nobody bothers to even say 'nice find mate'. By the same token, I hope that when I can't add anything more than my enthusiasm and congratulations to a thread but still want to show solidarity with one of you, I hope you are not offended or thinking 'spam'. IMHO there are no bad posts that are well intentioned. The only sad thing is seeing a '0' under replies. Regards Gene

25th June 2009, 04:47 PM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,739	Excellent responses here guys! As always I thank you all for the kindnesses toward my efforts, and recognizing the very deep passion I do have for the study of arms. It has been a lifelong passion that long exceeded my once concurrent passion for collecting. I only gave up the collecting in response to profound life events changing the means required to continue the hobby, not my interest in it. As I mentioned, it is wonderful that all of you so openly share your latest conquests and items in your collections, and I am able to vicariously enjoy them as well as continuing my research, which in kind, I enjoy sharing here. It is wonderful to see the beautifully crafted responses that you have posted here Vandoo, Fearn, Khanjar and Fearn (I know your real names, but use pen names for the benefit of the readers), and these are well thought out and worded, distinctly reflecting your own styles of writing and your distinct personalities. Your comments are all well placed, and have genuinely brought to my attention perspective I honestly had not thought of, and very much liked Atlantia's analogy of cornerstones and mortar! I agree that there are many variations to degree of response afforded to various posts, and often in proportion to each individuals familiarity or interest in a piece shared. That is well understood, and I admit that myself I often defer comment on the many topics I have limited resources or knowledge on, a broad range indeed, but honestly try to find something to say by searching as much as I can that I might try to say something. As noted, I find it very sad to see a post standing with 0 responses. What always impresses me is that there is indeed a great deal of solidarity here, and it is always a pleasure to see such gentlemanly behaviour even in the presence of obvious disagreement. I do admire the fact that everyone does come in with even kind comments that are 'brief' but complimentary when a new acquisition is posted. What I am saying is addressed to the many readers out there who are clearly present in considerable numbers and that thier input is welcomed.Despite the amount and depth of knowledge being imparted in these threads, it does not diminish the inclusion of the same kind of pleasant comment noted or well placed questions by newcomers or readers. We know you are out there, and we want to know what you think or what questions you might have. As I have always emphasized, it is how we all learn..together! We share thoughts , ideas, questions, and observations without reservation. I would again emphasize my deep gratitude to everyone here who does participate, and in whatever degree, and always admire the contributions in text from which I honestly believe we have all learned a great deal. With reference to the excellent analogy of cornerstones, and mortar....not forgetting the solidarity of the stones, I believe we all stand together as a sort of venerable bastion for the advancement of the study of historic arms and armour. Thank you again everyone! All very best regards, Jim

25th June 2009, 06:11 PM	#7
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,575	Hi, This is indeed an interesting and sometime difficult subject. As diverse as the subjects on the Forum so it is with the Members who participate, some may feel comfortable with one kind of approach whilst others do not. The dilemma of being really interested but judging whether to risk putting ones big foot in it while on the other hand not wanting to appear disinterested can be problematic, well, for me at least! Not all members have the same 'drive' or ambitions for their collections and it is important to include the curious as well as the enthusiast. I really feel for members, and it is normally newer ones, who, after putting out their hard earned cash, and it is really hard earned for some these days, on a piece find to their dismay that the 'gold' they have dug up is in actual fact 'mud'. I do think on these occasions that a 'diplomatic' and courteous let down is an absolute positive in getting these newer members to 'post and answer' in future and not to be left intimidated by their confusion or lack of knowledge, we all have lack of knowledge in many other spheres. This 'ignorance' can be the root of an unwillingness to reply to posts but is not to be confused with the 'ignorant', a situation which unfortunately a good member thought himself the subject of recently, re ignore list. I do not know of any members on this Forum who are disposed to be dismissive with regard to others ' buying mistakes' and lack of knowledge, we've all been there, in actual fact I have seen several very tactful let downs and corrections but I have seen the opposite on many other forums, sometimes it is the little green god at work, and it doesn't take too long for a clique to form and ruin it for others. I think proactive tolerance, courtesy and a willingness to illuminate, which I must say is very evident on this Forum and certainly lacking in some others, will go a long way in encouraging the less knowledgeable members, and I include myself in that merry band, joining in discussions. I sincerely hope that no Member will take any of the foregoing personally as this is not my intention it is simply observations I have made when comparing similar forums. My Regards, Norman.