Bali hilt

Marcokeris · 19th May 2013, 04:28 PM

I found this handle in the net (asian art museum San Francisco)

Sajen · 19th May 2013, 04:37 PM

A masterwork of carving, love the uwer from the same material (ivory).

Thank you for show us this beauty Marco.

Bjorn · 19th May 2013, 04:54 PM

Incredible detail. Truly deserves to be called a work of art!

Do you know whom is portrayed?

David · 19th May 2013, 07:38 PM

Wow...

Battara · 19th May 2013, 11:39 PM

Well I do know it is a demon for sure. What I am not sure is which one. I am wondering if it is Ravana, king of the demons from the Ramayana.

Is he holding a weapon of some kind?

A. G. Maisey · 20th May 2013, 02:43 AM

Wisnu in his incarnation as Kresna had a conch shell as a weapon --- Si Sangka Panacajaniya --- he had taken this conch shell from a demon, maybe this is supposed to be this demon, but I don't know his name.

It is worth noting that in Balinese representations of Hindu characters --- gods, demons etc --- the carver very often gives his own interpretation and sometimes gets things a bit mixed up. Particularly so in relatively modern carvings.

Battara · 20th May 2013, 04:33 AM

Alan,

What age would you give this piece?

A. G. Maisey · 20th May 2013, 06:39 AM

Too big a guess mate. Can't do it.

Ivory? De-natured antler? Bone?

How carved?

Can't tell these things from the pic.

Yes, its neat work, but I have Bali hilts done within the last five years that are as good, or maybe better.

However, after saying all that, I reckon its probably post 1930's. I say that only because I haven't seen a hell of a lot of really fine carving in hilts that pre-dates the upsurge in Balinese art that took place after European artists began to influence style and execution.

rasjid · 20th May 2013, 05:21 PM

The best Bali carver that I know of is IB Pastika, Bali.
He is fully booked and due to his age there will a long queue if we can get one ( took years)

If I comparing with this quality carving from the picture, I still think this is picture (post#1) still better from what I have seen from him. May be because I only seen less than 5 of his work.

I still love Pastika work though. ...

Rasjid

A. G. Maisey · 21st May 2013, 03:00 AM

Yeah, Ida Bagus Pastika's work is good. His interpretation of standard Balinese form has a liveliness that most other carvers seem to have difficulty in capturing --- including the carver who did the hilt in the SF musium.

Actually I don't like this musium hilt much, it is too fussy for my taste. The degree of skill required to carve it was high, but there is too much unnecessary detail which detracts from the possibility of a dynamic form. Still, I guess its all a matter of taste.

rasjid · 21st May 2013, 05:37 AM

How about this one Alan?

This is less complicated. .. its already 3D carving but is not too much detail?

A. G. Maisey · 21st May 2013, 09:01 AM

Yes, I do prefer that one, Rasjid.

This one I've posted a pic of is an older hilt, and very substantial, there is nothing delicate nor extreme in the carving, it was made with the intention of use, not just as an exercise to display the skill of the carver.

This is the style of execution I prefer in Balinese hilts, but it is rarely encountered in recently made hilts.

rasjid · 21st May 2013, 02:26 PM

Recently in Bali few years back started to have decent supply moose material.
This is the finished carving, white in colour as well. It will give a very smooth finish as well, better than bone finished.

Personally I do not like it very much, compared to ivory- this is too soft.
The carving can be done much easier on this material but ivory will last longer.

Hope the info useful.
Thanks

21st May 2013, 05:37 AM	#11
rasjid Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Jakarta - Indonesia Posts: 114	How about this one Alan? This is less complicated. .. its already 3D carving but is not too much detail? Attached Images

21st May 2013, 09:01 AM	#12
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,700	Yes, I do prefer that one, Rasjid. This one I've posted a pic of is an older hilt, and very substantial, there is nothing delicate nor extreme in the carving, it was made with the intention of use, not just as an exercise to display the skill of the carver. This is the style of execution I prefer in Balinese hilts, but it is rarely encountered in recently made hilts. Attached Images Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 21st May 2013 at 09:13 AM.

21st May 2013, 02:26 PM	#13
rasjid Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Jakarta - Indonesia Posts: 114	Recently in Bali few years back started to have decent supply moose material. This is the finished carving, white in colour as well. It will give a very smooth finish as well, better than bone finished. Personally I do not like it very much, compared to ivory- this is too soft. The carving can be done much easier on this material but ivory will last longer. Hope the info useful. Thanks Attached Images

19th May 2013, 04:28 PM	#1
Marcokeris Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Italy Posts: 928	Bali hilt I found this handle in the net (asian art museum San Francisco) Attached Images

19th May 2013, 04:37 PM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,491	A masterwork of carving, love the uwer from the same material (ivory). Thank you for show us this beauty Marco.

19th May 2013, 04:54 PM	#3
Bjorn Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 188	Incredible detail. Truly deserves to be called a work of art! Do you know whom is portrayed?

19th May 2013, 07:38 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,025	Wow...

19th May 2013, 11:39 PM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Well I do know it is a demon for sure. What I am not sure is which one. I am wondering if it is Ravana, king of the demons from the Ramayana. Is he holding a weapon of some kind?

20th May 2013, 02:43 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,700	Wisnu in his incarnation as Kresna had a conch shell as a weapon --- Si Sangka Panacajaniya --- he had taken this conch shell from a demon, maybe this is supposed to be this demon, but I don't know his name. It is worth noting that in Balinese representations of Hindu characters --- gods, demons etc --- the carver very often gives his own interpretation and sometimes gets things a bit mixed up. Particularly so in relatively modern carvings.

20th May 2013, 04:33 AM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Alan, What age would you give this piece?

20th May 2013, 06:39 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,700	Too big a guess mate. Can't do it. Ivory? De-natured antler? Bone? How carved? Can't tell these things from the pic. Yes, its neat work, but I have Bali hilts done within the last five years that are as good, or maybe better. However, after saying all that, I reckon its probably post 1930's. I say that only because I haven't seen a hell of a lot of really fine carving in hilts that pre-dates the upsurge in Balinese art that took place after European artists began to influence style and execution.

20th May 2013, 05:21 PM	#9
rasjid Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Jakarta - Indonesia Posts: 114	The best Bali carver that I know of is IB Pastika, Bali. He is fully booked and due to his age there will a long queue if we can get one ( took years) If I comparing with this quality carving from the picture, I still think this is picture (post#1) still better from what I have seen from him. May be because I only seen less than 5 of his work. I still love Pastika work though. ... Rasjid

21st May 2013, 03:00 AM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,700	Yeah, Ida Bagus Pastika's work is good. His interpretation of standard Balinese form has a liveliness that most other carvers seem to have difficulty in capturing --- including the carver who did the hilt in the SF musium. Actually I don't like this musium hilt much, it is too fussy for my taste. The degree of skill required to carve it was high, but there is too much unnecessary detail which detracts from the possibility of a dynamic form. Still, I guess its all a matter of taste.