TRIP TO MADAGASCAR ISLAND

carlos · 22nd July 2006, 10:14 AM

HELLO EVERYBODY!!
SOMEBODY KNOWS THA TYPICAL EDGED WEAPONS FROM MADAGASCAR? KNIVES AND SWORDS, I NEED SOME PICTURES OF THE KNIVES TO MY FRIENDS!.
THANKS YOU VERY MUCH!!
CARLOS

Tim Simmons · 22nd July 2006, 02:02 PM

How fantastic! your opportunity find out for us all. Have a super trip, do not forget your digital camera. lucky You

carlos · 22nd July 2006, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

How fantastic! your opportunity find out for us all. Have a super trip, do not forget your digital camera. lucky You

THANKS BUT THE TRIP IS FOR FRIENDS, NOT FOR ME!!

, THIS IS THE REASON I NEED PICTURES TO GIVE THEM!
THANKS

VANDOO · 23rd July 2006, 03:40 PM

I COULDN'T FIND ANY PICTURES OF EDGED WEAPONS FROM MADAGASCAR BUT GIVEN THE AREAS HISTORY IT IS NO TELLING WHAT YOU MIGHT FIND THERE. MANY DIFFERENT COUNTRYS HAVE BEEN INVOLVED THERE AND IMIGRATED OVER TIME QUEEN RANAVALONA WAS JUSTLY FAMOUS AS A REAL TERROR ALONG THE LINES OF POL POT OF CAMBODIA. THE MENABE TRIBE HAS MOST OF THE POWER BUT THERE WERE OTHER TRIBAL GROUPS SOME OF WHICH MAY HAVE BEEN ELIMINATED BY RAVNALONA? ADVISE YOUR FRIENDS TO READ UP ON THE AREA WELL AND LOOK OUT AS THEFT IS A VERY BIG PROBLEM IN THE BIG CITYS.
I READ AN INTERESTING ACCOUNT OF A BIOLOGIST WHO WAS OVER THERE STUDYIENG CHAMELION LIZZARDS (THERE ARE MORE DIFFERENT SPECIES THERE THAN IN THE REST OF THE WORLD) HE HAD SEVERAL LIVE SPECIMINS ON BRANCHES SUSPENDED FROM THE CELING OF HIS HOTEL ROOM FOR STUDY AND TO PHOTOGRAPH. WHILE HE WAS OUT THEIVES BROKE INTO HIS ROOM AND WOULD HAVE CLEANED HIM OUT ,BUT THE CHAMELION IS FEARED AND CONSIDERED VERY BAD LUCK THERE SO WHEN THEY TURNED ON THE LIGHTS AND SAW ALL OF THEM THEY COULD NOT GET OUT FAST ENOUGH. PERHAPS A PET CHAMELION MIGHT COME IN HANDY

PERHAPS YOU CAN SHOW YOUR COLLECTION TO YOUR FRIENDS AND THAT WILL GIVE THEM AN IDEA OF WHAT YOU LIKE, WHATS OLD AND WHATS TOURIST AND APPROX PRICE YOU WOULD PAY. GOOD LUCK

fearn · 23rd July 2006, 08:16 PM

Not a sword, but check out this spear called a Lefoantsoro.

The spear's from the Mikea "tribe" of SW Madagascar.

I posted this thread last February. The spear is being used as a prop at the Cleveland Botanic Garden. Last time I was there, it was half buried. Since the exhibit is really more about Malagasy plants than about Malagasy spears, it was to be expected. Still, I'd be happy to have one of those spears, if someone happens to bring a spare back.

F

Ian · 23rd July 2006, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

... PERHAPS A PET CHAMELION MIGHT COME IN HANDY

LOL

Radu Transylvanicus · 23rd July 2006, 10:20 PM

Madagascar - a lot more famous for its fauna than for its arsenal. VEry little if any is studied or published in the matter. Local reigns eventually prior to Europeans eliminated eachoters leadership but no significant battles or armies. A Polish commander took the island claiming it for France without much oposition. Pirate activity was fructuos on the coast, pre and post slave trade. Many utopic idea have been projected by Europeans for this island, the most absurd & outrageous and one belonged to the nazi Fuhrer, who contemplated plan "Madagaskar" according to which all Jews from Germany and eventually Europe would be relocated on this island.
There isnt even much of a record for hunting weapons from the natives. I suspect bow and arrow, spears and chopping machetes are what I suspect it was used.

fearn · 23rd July 2006, 11:37 PM

Hi Radu,

Probably right. Madagascar has a mix of farmers, cowherds, and fishermen, so you can expect typical tools of these groups.

The Mikea spear I referred to is a "typical" African spear, with a small leaf head on one end and a chisel blade on the other end, both fitted with fairly loose sockets.

I looked up the Mikea, and there's a story attached. The chisel end is for digging up wild yams, and the spear head is for "self defense." The Mikea "tribe" is a group of people who know how to hunt in the Mikea forest, and collect wild yams as part of their diet. The Mikea forest was one of those places where people who got into trouble ran to. The threat was always that any pursuer would get speared from ambush. Each end of the spear has a use.

So, the mikea spear is a sign of mikea identity. If you're carrying one of these spears/digging sticks and know how to use it, you're Mikea. Supposedly.

Nowdays, the Mikea forest is a conservation area, and "native" Mikea "tribesmen" have special rights to collect and grow crops in the forest. Who is and is not a Mikea suddenly matters, and apparently, there are all sorts of fights about who is and isn't genuine. Thanks to the (very necessary) conservation movement, these cheap-looking spears are now political symbols, apparently. Interesting stuff.

F

Radu Transylvanicus · 24th July 2006, 11:01 AM

Another try to put some more on the table:

A brief history lesson and a idealised "savages of Madagascar gravure" with WEAPONS (yeeeyyy...)
http://www.amphilsoc.org/library/exh...ky/unifier.htm

A mysterious shieldfrom Madagascar:
http://www.remnantsofritual.com/gallery/070.html

An interesting account of slave trade and history in Madagascar mentioning Malagasy (word for native Madagascarian) spears:
http://ritesofpassageblog.blogspot.c...ry-part-1.html

Luc LEFEBVRE · 1st June 2008, 03:20 PM

Go to AMNH site:
http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...ica_public.htm

choice Madagascar & knife

Luc

Luc LEFEBVRE · 1st June 2008, 03:35 PM

But I think the nicest knife from Madagascar is this kind of from the BARA people.
You can see a man sitting on the handle with a zebu and a crocodile, which are the reincarnation of ancestors, there is also a duck at the pommel, this bird is the intercessor between the life & death and a fecondity symbol.
Note that in this knife the blade is not in the axe of the handle.
Made of bronze and iron.

Luc

22nd July 2006, 10:14 AM	#1
carlos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 731	TRIP TO MADAGASCAR ISLAND HELLO EVERYBODY!! SOMEBODY KNOWS THA TYPICAL EDGED WEAPONS FROM MADAGASCAR? KNIVES AND SWORDS, I NEED SOME PICTURES OF THE KNIVES TO MY FRIENDS!. THANKS YOU VERY MUCH!! CARLOS

23rd July 2006, 08:16 PM	#5
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Not a sword, but check out this spear called a Lefoantsoro. The spear's from the Mikea "tribe" of SW Madagascar. I posted this thread last February. The spear is being used as a prop at the Cleveland Botanic Garden. Last time I was there, it was half buried. Since the exhibit is really more about Malagasy plants than about Malagasy spears, it was to be expected. Still, I'd be happy to have one of those spears, if someone happens to bring a spare back. F Last edited by fearn; 23rd July 2006 at 11:27 PM. Reason: better word choice

1st June 2008, 03:35 PM	#11
Luc LEFEBVRE Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: France Posts: 472	But I think the nicest knife from Madagascar is this kind of from the BARA people. You can see a man sitting on the handle with a zebu and a crocodile, which are the reincarnation of ancestors, there is also a duck at the pommel, this bird is the intercessor between the life & death and a fecondity symbol. Note that in this knife the blade is not in the axe of the handle. Made of bronze and iron. Luc Attached Images

22nd July 2006, 02:02 PM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	How fantastic! your opportunity find out for us all. Have a super trip, do not forget your digital camera. lucky You

23rd July 2006, 03:40 PM	#4
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	I COULDN'T FIND ANY PICTURES OF EDGED WEAPONS FROM MADAGASCAR BUT GIVEN THE AREAS HISTORY IT IS NO TELLING WHAT YOU MIGHT FIND THERE. MANY DIFFERENT COUNTRYS HAVE BEEN INVOLVED THERE AND IMIGRATED OVER TIME QUEEN RANAVALONA WAS JUSTLY FAMOUS AS A REAL TERROR ALONG THE LINES OF POL POT OF CAMBODIA. THE MENABE TRIBE HAS MOST OF THE POWER BUT THERE WERE OTHER TRIBAL GROUPS SOME OF WHICH MAY HAVE BEEN ELIMINATED BY RAVNALONA? ADVISE YOUR FRIENDS TO READ UP ON THE AREA WELL AND LOOK OUT AS THEFT IS A VERY BIG PROBLEM IN THE BIG CITYS. I READ AN INTERESTING ACCOUNT OF A BIOLOGIST WHO WAS OVER THERE STUDYIENG CHAMELION LIZZARDS (THERE ARE MORE DIFFERENT SPECIES THERE THAN IN THE REST OF THE WORLD) HE HAD SEVERAL LIVE SPECIMINS ON BRANCHES SUSPENDED FROM THE CELING OF HIS HOTEL ROOM FOR STUDY AND TO PHOTOGRAPH. WHILE HE WAS OUT THEIVES BROKE INTO HIS ROOM AND WOULD HAVE CLEANED HIM OUT ,BUT THE CHAMELION IS FEARED AND CONSIDERED VERY BAD LUCK THERE SO WHEN THEY TURNED ON THE LIGHTS AND SAW ALL OF THEM THEY COULD NOT GET OUT FAST ENOUGH. PERHAPS A PET CHAMELION MIGHT COME IN HANDY PERHAPS YOU CAN SHOW YOUR COLLECTION TO YOUR FRIENDS AND THAT WILL GIVE THEM AN IDEA OF WHAT YOU LIKE, WHATS OLD AND WHATS TOURIST AND APPROX PRICE YOU WOULD PAY. GOOD LUCK

23rd July 2006, 10:20 PM	#7
Radu Transylvanicus Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: 2008-2010 Bali, 1998-2008 USA Posts: 271	Madagascar - a lot more famous for its fauna than for its arsenal. VEry little if any is studied or published in the matter. Local reigns eventually prior to Europeans eliminated eachoters leadership but no significant battles or armies. A Polish commander took the island claiming it for France without much oposition. Pirate activity was fructuos on the coast, pre and post slave trade. Many utopic idea have been projected by Europeans for this island, the most absurd & outrageous and one belonged to the nazi Fuhrer, who contemplated plan "Madagaskar" according to which all Jews from Germany and eventually Europe would be relocated on this island. There isnt even much of a record for hunting weapons from the natives. I suspect bow and arrow, spears and chopping machetes are what I suspect it was used.

23rd July 2006, 11:37 PM	#8
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi Radu, Probably right. Madagascar has a mix of farmers, cowherds, and fishermen, so you can expect typical tools of these groups. The Mikea spear I referred to is a "typical" African spear, with a small leaf head on one end and a chisel blade on the other end, both fitted with fairly loose sockets. I looked up the Mikea, and there's a story attached. The chisel end is for digging up wild yams, and the spear head is for "self defense." The Mikea "tribe" is a group of people who know how to hunt in the Mikea forest, and collect wild yams as part of their diet. The Mikea forest was one of those places where people who got into trouble ran to. The threat was always that any pursuer would get speared from ambush. Each end of the spear has a use. So, the mikea spear is a sign of mikea identity. If you're carrying one of these spears/digging sticks and know how to use it, you're Mikea. Supposedly. Nowdays, the Mikea forest is a conservation area, and "native" Mikea "tribesmen" have special rights to collect and grow crops in the forest. Who is and is not a Mikea suddenly matters, and apparently, there are all sorts of fights about who is and isn't genuine. Thanks to the (very necessary) conservation movement, these cheap-looking spears are now political symbols, apparently. Interesting stuff. F

24th July 2006, 11:01 AM	#9
Radu Transylvanicus Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: 2008-2010 Bali, 1998-2008 USA Posts: 271	Another try to put some more on the table: A brief history lesson and a idealised "savages of Madagascar gravure" with WEAPONS (yeeeyyy...) http://www.amphilsoc.org/library/exh...ky/unifier.htm A mysterious shieldfrom Madagascar: http://www.remnantsofritual.com/gallery/070.html An interesting account of slave trade and history in Madagascar mentioning Malagasy (word for native Madagascarian) spears: http://ritesofpassageblog.blogspot.c...ry-part-1.html

1st June 2008, 03:20 PM	#10
Luc LEFEBVRE Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: France Posts: 472	Go to AMNH site: http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...ica_public.htm choice Madagascar & knife Luc