Koummya with nice(?) blade

shayde78 · 3rd August 2017, 10:02 PM

I finally found a koummya with a blade nicer than I have seen in person. The thing that seems incongruent to me is the fact that the scabbard is a muddled mess. That leads me to think I am overestimating the quality of the blade, or that the blade was refitted with furniture of lesser quality.

What are your thoughts? For scale, the tiles are 1'x1'.

Thanks all!

shayde78 · 3rd August 2017, 10:05 PM

Also, while on the topic, I have had this other example that, although the blade seems not too impressive, the ornamentation on the scabbard seems quite well done. Additionally, both sides are treated with the same decoration. The feature I'd like to get feedback on are the suspension rings. They are as nicely designed as the rest, and are fully integrated into the scabbard. I haven't seen this element before...is it specific to a distinct form/period?

Cheers.

Sajen · 3rd August 2017, 11:15 PM

For me, and I am not an expert by this sort of daggers, is the first one the real deal. Look to the worn holes for the carrying strip, this dagger was long time in use, so also the blade for real use and the worn and (tribal) repaired scabbard. I would choose the first one!

Regards,
Detlef

Kubur · 4th August 2017, 09:19 AM

If you want some brights comments, you should use a flash!

motan · 4th August 2017, 12:47 PM

Hi Detlef,
I think the blade IS good, but probably foreign made, because of the a-typical bevels. Usually, sides have an unsharpened edge of different lengths: long on convex side and short on the concave side. In yours, the bevels start at the same place, but there is an additional one on the convex side. The forte looks very European-like in a straight hunting dagger.
The scabbard and hilt look like they have been of good quality, but are worn beyond recognition. So, besides the poor condition of the outer part, it probably IS or at least was a good and old dagger.
This assymetry in all koummyas is food for thought. I do not know how curved daggers were used in general, but both sides are usually sharpened in the same way. So, both sides can be equally used for cutting. In koummyas, it appears that the main edge for cutting is the concave edge. Not only because it is longer, but also because in examples where the blade is deformed by re-sharpening, it is the inner edge that has been mostly re-sharpened. A throat cutter??

motan · 4th August 2017, 12:52 PM

Hi Shayde78,
I am sorry to say that, but the blade is NOT a good blade and the whole is typical of a koummya made for the tourist trade.
Keep looking and read references in the forum for some good examples.

3rd August 2017, 10:02 PM	#1
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 443	Koummya with nice(?) blade I finally found a koummya with a blade nicer than I have seen in person. The thing that seems incongruent to me is the fact that the scabbard is a muddled mess. That leads me to think I am overestimating the quality of the blade, or that the blade was refitted with furniture of lesser quality. What are your thoughts? For scale, the tiles are 1'x1'. Thanks all! Attached Images

3rd August 2017, 10:05 PM	#2
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 443	Also, while on the topic, I have had this other example that, although the blade seems not too impressive, the ornamentation on the scabbard seems quite well done. Additionally, both sides are treated with the same decoration. The feature I'd like to get feedback on are the suspension rings. They are as nicely designed as the rest, and are fully integrated into the scabbard. I haven't seen this element before...is it specific to a distinct form/period? Cheers. Attached Images

3rd August 2017, 11:15 PM	#3
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,467	For me, and I am not an expert by this sort of daggers, is the first one the real deal. Look to the worn holes for the carrying strip, this dagger was long time in use, so also the blade for real use and the worn and (tribal) repaired scabbard. I would choose the first one! Regards, Detlef

4th August 2017, 09:19 AM	#4
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	If you want some brights comments, you should use a flash!

4th August 2017, 12:47 PM	#5
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Detlef, I think the blade IS good, but probably foreign made, because of the a-typical bevels. Usually, sides have an unsharpened edge of different lengths: long on convex side and short on the concave side. In yours, the bevels start at the same place, but there is an additional one on the convex side. The forte looks very European-like in a straight hunting dagger. The scabbard and hilt look like they have been of good quality, but are worn beyond recognition. So, besides the poor condition of the outer part, it probably IS or at least was a good and old dagger. This assymetry in all koummyas is food for thought. I do not know how curved daggers were used in general, but both sides are usually sharpened in the same way. So, both sides can be equally used for cutting. In koummyas, it appears that the main edge for cutting is the concave edge. Not only because it is longer, but also because in examples where the blade is deformed by re-sharpening, it is the inner edge that has been mostly re-sharpened. A throat cutter??

4th August 2017, 12:52 PM	#6
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Shayde78, I am sorry to say that, but the blade is NOT a good blade and the whole is typical of a koummya made for the tourist trade. Keep looking and read references in the forum for some good examples.