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24th April 2024, 11:17 AM | #1 |
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First Post - Identification Assistance Much Appreciated
Hi,
Really happy to be part of this group. I haven't the slightest clue about krises and the family collection has been handed down to me. Appreciate all the wisdom, knowledge, comments etc. Thanks. Omar |
26th April 2024, 12:13 AM | #2 |
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Welcome to the forum Omar,
Looks like a keris picit or pejetan to my eyes. Scabbard is a recent replacement like the handle also. Blade seems to be old but pictures can deceive. Regards, Detlef |
26th April 2024, 02:30 AM | #3 |
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It might be a Sombro.
try removing the hilt, it is likely to be only a pressure fit, the tang wound with thread or cloth, if it is tight & difficult to remove, leave it . But if you can remove the hilt, & the end of the tang has an eye-hole in it, either broken or unbroken, then we can call it a Sombro. |
26th April 2024, 05:50 AM | #4 |
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Hi Alan,
Beside the eye hole in the end of the tang what are the other characteristics for Sombro style Keris? Ganja iras or not? Thank you |
26th April 2024, 11:50 AM | #5 |
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All Sombro I've seen had a ganja iras.
Here my example. |
26th April 2024, 01:12 PM | #6 |
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Thank you very much. I hv had to look up for most of the terms used in the replies to even understand things.
I hv attached a few more pics of the blade. As for removing the hilt, am worried that I can't put it together again.: Cheers. |
27th April 2024, 03:44 AM | #7 |
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Thank you Sajen
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27th April 2024, 10:26 PM | #8 | |
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Quote:
It does indeed look to be a Keris Sombro, but a hole in the end of the pesi (tang) would be a defining trademark. These are so called after a legendary female Empu (keris smith) who used to thread these blades to carry them around and if you wanted one in the middle of the bunch the eye in the pesi was usually broken as she pulled it off the string. As Alan explained, a keris hilt is usually pressure fit into the hilt, This is done by wrapping fabric or thread around the pesi (tang) any sort of screwing the pesi up into the hole in the hilt. I can understand if you choose not to mess with it, but reattaching a hilt in this manner is not very difficult. It is pretty much a "skill" that all keris collectors learn pretty early on. If you are really worried about this then leave it as is, but then you really can't be sure if it is indeed a Sombro keris. If the hilt hasn't been fixed with an adhesive you should be able to turn the hilt back and forth. Wiggling it gently while pulling the back on the hilt should allow it to come off. Once the hilt is off it will be pretty obvious what needs to be done to put it back in place. |
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28th April 2024, 05:34 AM | #9 |
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Thank you very much Sajen and Alan for your guidance to remove the hilt. It was a pressure fit feeling. I have enclosed 2 more images for you to see.
Were these types of keris more weapons or amulets? For the average common guy? How would I best summarise this weapon in point form: Origin, blade, dapor etc Cheers. |
28th April 2024, 09:54 PM | #10 |
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Yes, this is a Sombro.
We do not apply tangguh indicators to this form of keris, Keris Sombro is sufficient. Within Javanese culture & society these keris are considered to be amulets, people seem to have varying ideas about what their talismanic qualities are except that these are invariably positive, however, it does seem to be universally recognised that they will assist in childbirth. |
28th April 2024, 10:07 PM | #11 |
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Yes, clearly a keris Sombro.
The handle looks in your new pictures much better. The mendak (the ring) is a little bit damaged but I would still use it until you find a better one. Regards, Detlef |
29th April 2024, 02:29 AM | #12 |
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I agree with all here. Hilt may not be "new", but contemporary. As for origin, Jawa, hilt might be East Jawa.
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30th April 2024, 03:32 PM | #13 |
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Thanks for the info Alan, David and Sajen.
If one were to be conservative, how old would a blade like this be? Cheers. |
30th April 2024, 09:16 PM | #14 |
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That's always a very difficult question, especially with this type of keris because it has very very stylistic indicators. Your keris does seem to present itself as being very old just from the nature of the erosion on the edges and tip. If it were to be a keris that was actually made by the legendary Empu Nyai Mbok Sombro it would date back to the 13th century Pajajaran kingdom of West Jawa. But the name Keris Sombro has become a style rather than an attribution and there is no real way to determine if this keris was an origin Sombro keris. I would say that it is certainly very old and if you want to be conservative you might say 15th century? Of course the dress in much, much newer.
Last edited by David; 1st May 2024 at 03:03 PM. Reason: Spelling |
2nd May 2024, 04:28 PM | #15 | |
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Quote:
Would it perhaps be better for me to display this sombro without the hilt and sheath? or will that be considered to be against keris protocol? |
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3rd May 2024, 10:25 PM | #16 | |
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4th May 2024, 10:08 AM | #17 | |
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Regards, Detlef |
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4th May 2024, 05:13 PM | #18 |
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My personal feeling about keris is that they should always be kept in their sheath when not being viewed. Many collectors wrap their keris in plastic so as not to have the metal in constant contact with the wood, but my understanding is that the sheath is the home for the wilah and that there is also a spiritual masculine/feminine, lingam/yoni kind of relationship here an that the sheath protects the spirit of the keris. But for a collector outside of the culture these aspects may be less important. So yes, as Detlef says, it is the choice of the collector.
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