Arabian wootz beauty 2

eftihis · 24th April 2005, 09:56 PM

Another arabic sword with a very nice wootz blade. I found it together with the other with the silver scabbard, and maybe they come from the same place. The scabbard is incredibly light, and that gives you the feeling that is a great fighting weapon.

RSWORD · 25th April 2005, 12:08 AM

Thank you for posting the pics of this lovely sword. It helps illustrate how "parts" made their way throughout the region. If not for the handle, this could be purely a Persian sword. The scabbard mounts are classical Persian, as is, the crossguard. They have very likely been recycled through and mounted up Arab style. The blade could very well be a Persian one as well. Nice sword!

Jeff D · 25th April 2005, 01:48 AM

Sweet saber,

I agree with Rick except the wootz looks more "granular" which would suggest an Indian origin. I can't tell is there a ricasso?

Nice find.
Jeff

M.carter · 25th April 2005, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff D

Sweet saber,

I agree with Rick except the wootz looks more "granular" which would suggest an Indian origin. I can't tell is there a ricasso?

Nice find.
Jeff

I would have to disagree with you Jeff. I think the wootz is of typical syrian 'sham' wootz, but this time with a high contrast. I agree with rick on his points. The scabbard is totally Persian, so is the crossguard too.

Jeff D · 25th April 2005, 11:34 PM

Hi Mike,

Nice to see you here. To me the wootz shows the highly "spheroidized" pattern indicitive of 19th century Indian work. Similar patterns can be seen on 30-31 of Figiel's 'On Damascus Steel'. This isn't the usual "stripy" pattern seen on Syrian wootz. Here is a Katar with the Indian wootz I have mentioned. Other similar pieces can be found at Oriental Arms, as well as sham wootz. It may be Persian as Rick has stated, but they usually avoided "over" working the steel which contributes to this "spheroidization".

Jeff

RSWORD · 26th April 2005, 02:19 AM

The blade really could have originated from any a number of sources. The tight pattern is found on many Indian blades. I have also seen it on a few Persian pieces and also on some Ottoman blades. I agree that the watering is not of the "Shami" form that is often associated with Syrian or Ottoman work. One interesting feature to this Shamshir is the nicely ground fuller just beneath the spine that runs about half way down the blade. On this sword, I would closely at the cross guard and the scabbard mounts because there is a good chance they are wootz as well!

Ann Feuerbach · 28th April 2005, 03:38 PM

I think the blades pattern is referred to as "network" or "dendritic". Doesn't look like a Sham pattern to me. I think it is Indian. It reminds me of some Sri Lankan ingots

Ann

Gt Obach · 29th April 2005, 01:17 AM

the etch looks different.....it reminds me of some of the blades that I've etched with ferric chloride.... maybe its the photo......does the etch look greyish?

sometimes when you forge a blade you will get these weird cracking/delaminations.... and the only cure is to grind it out....then keep forging... this gives the blade a very dendritic pattern... almost tiger stripey

stock reducing... cuts through the sheets in wootz... and gives the pin like carbide waterings..... just look at the rungs in the ladder pattern... the rungs are very pin like

just my 2 cents

Greg

by the way..... super nice sword !!

Battara · 30th April 2005, 01:52 PM

I like the wootz and the silver work, though I wish it were in better condition. Still, very nice.

24th April 2005, 09:56 PM	#1
eftihis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chania Crete Greece Posts: 500	Arabian wootz beauty 2 Another arabic sword with a very nice wootz blade. I found it together with the other with the silver scabbard, and maybe they come from the same place. The scabbard is incredibly light, and that gives you the feeling that is a great fighting weapon. Attached Images

25th April 2005, 11:34 PM	#5
Jeff D Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 473	Hi Mike, Nice to see you here. To me the wootz shows the highly "spheroidized" pattern indicitive of 19th century Indian work. Similar patterns can be seen on 30-31 of Figiel's 'On Damascus Steel'. This isn't the usual "stripy" pattern seen on Syrian wootz. Here is a Katar with the Indian wootz I have mentioned. Other similar pieces can be found at Oriental Arms, as well as sham wootz. It may be Persian as Rick has stated, but they usually avoided "over" working the steel which contributes to this "spheroidization". Jeff Attached Images

25th April 2005, 12:08 AM	#2
RSWORD Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,083	Thank you for posting the pics of this lovely sword. It helps illustrate how "parts" made their way throughout the region. If not for the handle, this could be purely a Persian sword. The scabbard mounts are classical Persian, as is, the crossguard. They have very likely been recycled through and mounted up Arab style. The blade could very well be a Persian one as well. Nice sword!

25th April 2005, 01:48 AM	#3
Jeff D Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 473	Sweet saber, I agree with Rick except the wootz looks more "granular" which would suggest an Indian origin. I can't tell is there a ricasso? Nice find. Jeff

26th April 2005, 02:19 AM	#6
RSWORD Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,083	The blade really could have originated from any a number of sources. The tight pattern is found on many Indian blades. I have also seen it on a few Persian pieces and also on some Ottoman blades. I agree that the watering is not of the "Shami" form that is often associated with Syrian or Ottoman work. One interesting feature to this Shamshir is the nicely ground fuller just beneath the spine that runs about half way down the blade. On this sword, I would closely at the cross guard and the scabbard mounts because there is a good chance they are wootz as well!

28th April 2005, 03:38 PM	#7
Ann Feuerbach Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 133	I think the blades pattern is referred to as "network" or "dendritic". Doesn't look like a Sham pattern to me. I think it is Indian. It reminds me of some Sri Lankan ingots Ann

29th April 2005, 01:17 AM	#8
Gt Obach Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 116	the etch looks different.....it reminds me of some of the blades that I've etched with ferric chloride.... maybe its the photo......does the etch look greyish? sometimes when you forge a blade you will get these weird cracking/delaminations.... and the only cure is to grind it out....then keep forging... this gives the blade a very dendritic pattern... almost tiger stripey stock reducing... cuts through the sheets in wootz... and gives the pin like carbide waterings..... just look at the rungs in the ladder pattern... the rungs are very pin like just my 2 cents Greg by the way..... super nice sword !!

30th April 2005, 01:52 PM	#9
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	I like the wootz and the silver work, though I wish it were in better condition. Still, very nice.