A long Piso

Tim Simmons · 19th August 2007, 01:22 PM

Podang. Is this a local blade. I will post better pics when it arrives. It seems a long one the total length is 42.5 inches.

VVV · 19th August 2007, 09:21 PM

Nice!

Seems like a straight Piso Podang which is more rare than the curved one.
Look forward to see more pictures when it has arrived.

Michael

katana · 20th August 2007, 04:57 PM

Nice addition Tim.....bid on this myself.....nice to see a fellow formite won it

Look forward to future pictures. Not so certain about the Samoan link

Tim Simmons · 20th August 2007, 05:14 PM

Thanks David, I am hoping that it is a nice local blade and not a knackered pitted old thing, usually they do not come with a scabbard so fingers crossed. Sorry about out biding but life is like that. Remeber the old Charles Atlas adverts

.

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 04:48 PM

In spite of it not really being my thing and knowing nothing about this area I find this sword quite interesting. The blade is 96cm long and flexible like a cavalry sabre. I think it is a slashing weapon. I also think it is of native manufacture although the engraving on the back does have some semblance to European writing, but I do not think it is. The whole thing was covered in old yellowed varnish. Once removed it is possible to see that the blade is covered in the paterns of folded steel, pamor? has been etched? and in very go condition as is the scabbard except a few rattan rings are missing. If any body has some old rattan rings bits they do not need you could pm me

Anyway here are some pics of the whole thing and close ups latter.

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 04:58 PM

Engraving on the back. What is it? is it shown the right way round?

More close ups of blade. The back of the blade is at the bottom of the picture.

Any comments? tell me more about it?

galvano · 31st August 2007, 05:41 PM

engraving is
" manufacture nationale de klingenthal " making by " Couleau "
in europe we have many blades from Couleau
galvano

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 06:37 PM

Galvano that is so helpful I can see it now, how fascinating! I cannot tell which period according to this link

http://users.skynet.be/euro-swords/klingenthal.htm

I did not know there was any French influence in Sumatra/Borneo. The big question is was the blade made in a manner that appealed to the region or were the blades finished in a standard European fashion and then altered with etching by and to suit the new owners?

I think I have some pictures of Sumatra mounted warrior I will look them out and post them.

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 06:51 PM

Well you learn something everyday. I was well aware of French Indochina but now consderable trade and influence in Sumatra and there abouts. The Brits may as we are told have had a bigger slice of the cake but the French had very often got there first. Respect

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 07:16 PM

Making limited research using the PC, this blade is likely to be from the early part of the 19th century?

Tim Simmons · 31st August 2007, 07:35 PM

Sorry to keep banging on about this but I am finding these things out as I handle it. I think these blades were definitely made by the French to appeal to the local taste. The fact that there is little to no acid attack on the engraving to the back of the blade at the forte bares this out.

galvano · 31st August 2007, 09:14 PM

it is 19th century.
galvano

Tim Simmons · 1st September 2007, 10:35 AM

http://home.hccnet.nl/wer.davies/dav1800.html

Lew · 1st September 2007, 12:38 PM

Hi Galvano

That is a nice find. I have seen pisos with native made blades and wootz blades imported from Persia so why not a French blade. Many cultures in Asia and surrounding areas considered European blades to be superior to their own locally made blades and were very desirable to own.

Lew

Tim Simmons · 1st September 2007, 01:48 PM

I think this is just pattern welded steel finished to suit the Sumaran taste. Like much of French bladed weaponry it is rather nice.

Tim Simmons · 1st September 2007, 04:39 PM

This might help explain French weapons in Sumatra.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Padri_War

I do not think a Dutch or British colonial administration would welcome thier enemy or recent enemy free trade to arm the bolshy natives?

asomotif · 3rd September 2007, 02:06 PM

I can not read the date / year on the blade's back.
Which year is it ?

I should check some books, but this is a french 'heavy' cavalry blade I think.

very nice catch.

Tim Simmons · 3rd September 2007, 07:41 PM

In spite of using the finest emery paper and lighter fuel to clean where you would expect to find a date, sadly just nothing there. The blade does appear to be a version of a pattern sabre in use in Napoleonic period. The French did establish a military force on Java. I suspect there were groups that took advantage of this?

Tim Simmons · 3rd September 2007, 08:56 PM

Interesting quick read. I doubt the ruling powers were happy to let the French continue to supply the region with weapons.
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-22812/Indonesia

Tim Simmons · 3rd September 2007, 09:12 PM

Even better stuff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herman_Willem_Daendels

19th August 2007, 01:22 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	A long Piso Podang. Is this a local blade. I will post better pics when it arrives. It seems a long one the total length is 42.5 inches. Attached Images

31st August 2007, 04:48 PM	#5
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Finally got my hands on it In spite of it not really being my thing and knowing nothing about this area I find this sword quite interesting. The blade is 96cm long and flexible like a cavalry sabre. I think it is a slashing weapon. I also think it is of native manufacture although the engraving on the back does have some semblance to European writing, but I do not think it is. The whole thing was covered in old yellowed varnish. Once removed it is possible to see that the blade is covered in the paterns of folded steel, pamor? has been etched? and in very go condition as is the scabbard except a few rattan rings are missing. If any body has some old rattan rings bits they do not need you could pm me Anyway here are some pics of the whole thing and close ups latter.

31st August 2007, 04:58 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	More close up Engraving on the back. What is it? is it shown the right way round? More close ups of blade. The back of the blade is at the bottom of the picture. Any comments? tell me more about it?

31st August 2007, 05:41 PM	#7
galvano Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 176	hi all engraving is " manufacture nationale de klingenthal " making by " Couleau " in europe we have many blades from Couleau galvano

31st August 2007, 07:35 PM	#11
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Sorry to keep banging on about this but I am finding these things out as I handle it. I think these blades were definitely made by the French to appeal to the local taste. The fact that there is little to no acid attack on the engraving to the back of the blade at the forte bares this out. Last edited by Tim Simmons; 31st August 2007 at 08:11 PM.

19th August 2007, 09:21 PM	#2
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Nice! Seems like a straight Piso Podang which is more rare than the curved one. Look forward to see more pictures when it has arrived. Michael

20th August 2007, 04:57 PM	#3
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Nice addition Tim.....bid on this myself.....nice to see a fellow formite won it Look forward to future pictures. Not so certain about the Samoan link

20th August 2007, 05:14 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Thanks David, I am hoping that it is a nice local blade and not a knackered pitted old thing, usually they do not come with a scabbard so fingers crossed. Sorry about out biding but life is like that. Remeber the old Charles Atlas adverts .

31st August 2007, 06:37 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Galvano that is so helpful I can see it now, how fascinating! I cannot tell which period according to this link http://users.skynet.be/euro-swords/klingenthal.htm I did not know there was any French influence in Sumatra/Borneo. The big question is was the blade made in a manner that appealed to the region or were the blades finished in a standard European fashion and then altered with etching by and to suit the new owners? I think I have some pictures of Sumatra mounted warrior I will look them out and post them.

31st August 2007, 06:51 PM	#9
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Well you learn something everyday. I was well aware of French Indochina but now consderable trade and influence in Sumatra and there abouts. The Brits may as we are told have had a bigger slice of the cake but the French had very often got there first. Respect

31st August 2007, 07:16 PM	#10
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Making limited research using the PC, this blade is likely to be from the early part of the 19th century?

31st August 2007, 09:14 PM	#12
galvano Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 176	couleaux frére it is 19th century. galvano

1st September 2007, 10:35 AM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Stuff on Napoleonic Sumatra http://home.hccnet.nl/wer.davies/dav1800.html

1st September 2007, 12:38 PM	#14
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Hi Galvano That is a nice find. I have seen pisos with native made blades and wootz blades imported from Persia so why not a French blade. Many cultures in Asia and surrounding areas considered European blades to be superior to their own locally made blades and were very desirable to own. Lew

1st September 2007, 01:48 PM	#15
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	I think this is just pattern welded steel finished to suit the Sumaran taste. Like much of French bladed weaponry it is rather nice.

1st September 2007, 04:39 PM	#16
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	This might help explain French weapons in Sumatra. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Padri_War I do not think a Dutch or British colonial administration would welcome thier enemy or recent enemy free trade to arm the bolshy natives?

3rd September 2007, 02:06 PM	#17
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,221	I can not read the date / year on the blade's back. Which year is it ? I should check some books, but this is a french 'heavy' cavalry blade I think. very nice catch.

3rd September 2007, 07:41 PM	#18
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	In spite of using the finest emery paper and lighter fuel to clean where you would expect to find a date, sadly just nothing there. The blade does appear to be a version of a pattern sabre in use in Napoleonic period. The French did establish a military force on Java. I suspect there were groups that took advantage of this?

3rd September 2007, 08:56 PM	#19
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Interesting quick read. I doubt the ruling powers were happy to let the French continue to supply the region with weapons. http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-22812/Indonesia

3rd September 2007, 09:12 PM	#20
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Even better stuff. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herman_Willem_Daendels