What Is This

archer · 6th October 2010, 04:32 AM

What is this? What culture do you think it comes from? Is it the first Ethnographic Fantasy Dagger?
14inches overall with double 8 inch blades. If it's a type Bichwa then it's probably left handed. Hasn't come in yet. Intriguing, blades may be suspect.
So much work went into it I had to see first hand.
It coming from Nesher, Israel.
Comments and advice welcome, Steve

Ron Anderson · 6th October 2010, 05:13 AM

It's amazing, whatever it is. You've certainly picked up something very very nice.

It wouldn't surprise me if this was Indian. Could be wrong but those horns remind me of fakir's horns.

Jim McDougall · 6th October 2010, 05:46 AM

Extremely nice Archer!!!
This is indeed a dual bladed bichwa, and interesting in being fashioned into a scabbard made from the style buffalo horns used for the madu madu, a parrying weapon with buffalo horns usually opposed and attached in the center.
These weapons gave the origin of the haladie, whose blades typically followed the contour of the buffalo horns and as I understand, were often considered to have Rajput origins. The design ended up as far west as Syria and ultimately became a known weapon in the Sudan.

The bichwa itself, while known through much of India in Mahratta regions, seems to have been well established with dual blades in Gujerat (also Kutch) as well as Rajasthan in degree. Many of these have the loop type hilt.

The silver mounts on this are exquisite! as is the dagger overall, and reflects quite possibly an important weapon of probably early to mid 19th century. As noted, the blades will tell more, but it looks great so far.

Beautiful!!!

All the best,
Jim

VANDOO · 6th October 2010, 05:54 AM

BEAUTIFUL WORKMANSHIP AND A VERY UNIQUE DAGGER. I AGREE IT IS LIKELY FROM INDIA AND THE TWO HORNS APPEAR TO BE FROM A SMALL ANTELOPE CALLED BLACKBUCK WHICH IS FOUND IN INDIA AND USED FOR A FEW WEAPONS AS JIM MENTIONED. THE HANDLE APPEARS TO HAVE COME FROM A LARGER HORN MOST LIKELY WATER BUFFALOW. CONGRADULATIONS.

Battara · 6th October 2010, 06:07 AM

Beautiful silver work! What a piece!

Ron Anderson · 6th October 2010, 07:34 AM

Blackbuck horns are indeed used on the weapons known as fakir's horns.

I will post a picture of my pair. They are not all that small. They can grow quite large.

But these are obviously smaller.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 22nd November 2011, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by archer

What is this? What culture do you think it comes from? Is it the first Ethnographic Fantasy Dagger?
14inches overall with double 8 inch blades. If it's a type Bichwa then it's probably left handed. Hasn't come in yet. Intriguing, blades may be suspect.
So much work went into it I had to see first hand.
It coming from Nesher, Israel.
Comments and advice welcome, Steve

Salaams Steve,
I have a small project in hand to look at Gazelle horn across the entire spectrum of artefacts in Oman and have a few pictures almost ready. It is interesting to see how diverse were the uses of this material and I will prepare the small research info in the next few days.

Regards Ibrahiim.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 23rd November 2011, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by archer

What is this? What culture do you think it comes from? Is it the first Ethnographic Fantasy Dagger?
14inches overall with double 8 inch blades. If it's a type Bichwa then it's probably left handed. Hasn't come in yet. Intriguing, blades may be suspect.
So much work went into it I had to see first hand.
It coming from Nesher, Israel.
Comments and advice welcome, Steve

Salaams Steve,

As promised here is the result of a short sharp scan into uses of the same Gazelle horn in Oman and in fact other Bedouin Arab areas where it is used;

1. In Syria it is used on the loom(nol) where it is called Mishga or mihta used as a beating hook to ram the weaving tight; "The Arts and Crafts of Syria" by Johannes Kalter published by Thames and Hudson refers.

2. It is used in the same way in the Huwaytat Bedouin group in Trans Jordan . "The Bedoiuin" By Shelagh Weir refers.

3. In Oman amongst the bedouin in the Sharqiyyah (Wihabi Tribes)and other areas of Northern Oman ~ same same ~ where it has the name Mishrat ...according to the book "Bedouin"...Nomads of the desert by Alan Keohane.

4. The other interesting use in Oman was as a powder horn, adorned with silver; according to the superb, double volume book "The Craft Herritage of Oman" by Richardson and Dorr published by Motivate Publishing.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

archer · 25th November 2011, 01:07 AM

Thank you for your research Ibraham. I'm sure it will provide further incite to others' quests. I saw another similar dagger on E bay here are a few photos. Is there any meaning to the five point star within the larger six point star in the design? thank you, Steve I'm unable to show the star design, but, you get the idea.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 25th November 2011, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by archer

Thank you for your research Ibraham. I'm sure it will provide further incite to others' quests. I saw another similar dagger on E bay here are a few photos. Is there any meaning to the five point star within the larger six point star in the design? thank you, Steve I'm unable to show the star design, but, you get the idea.

Salaams ... Check this out ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandala

Geometry in Hindu and indeed Islamic art and history is a vast subject...The work above deals with the Hindu side. Regards Ibrahiim.

6th October 2010, 04:32 AM	#1
archer Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 373	What Is This What is this? What culture do you think it comes from? Is it the first Ethnographic Fantasy Dagger? 14inches overall with double 8 inch blades. If it's a type Bichwa then it's probably left handed. Hasn't come in yet. Intriguing, blades may be suspect. So much work went into it I had to see first hand. It coming from Nesher, Israel. Comments and advice welcome, Steve Attached Images

25th November 2011, 01:07 AM	#9
archer Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 373	A second odd Bichwa Thank you for your research Ibraham. I'm sure it will provide further incite to others' quests. I saw another similar dagger on E bay here are a few photos. Is there any meaning to the five point star within the larger six point star in the design? thank you, Steve I'm unable to show the star design, but, you get the idea. Attached Images Last edited by archer; 25th November 2011 at 01:18 AM.

6th October 2010, 05:13 AM	#2
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	It's amazing, whatever it is. You've certainly picked up something very very nice. It wouldn't surprise me if this was Indian. Could be wrong but those horns remind me of fakir's horns.

6th October 2010, 05:46 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,758	Extremely nice Archer!!! This is indeed a dual bladed bichwa, and interesting in being fashioned into a scabbard made from the style buffalo horns used for the madu madu, a parrying weapon with buffalo horns usually opposed and attached in the center. These weapons gave the origin of the haladie, whose blades typically followed the contour of the buffalo horns and as I understand, were often considered to have Rajput origins. The design ended up as far west as Syria and ultimately became a known weapon in the Sudan. The bichwa itself, while known through much of India in Mahratta regions, seems to have been well established with dual blades in Gujerat (also Kutch) as well as Rajasthan in degree. Many of these have the loop type hilt. The silver mounts on this are exquisite! as is the dagger overall, and reflects quite possibly an important weapon of probably early to mid 19th century. As noted, the blades will tell more, but it looks great so far. Beautiful!!! All the best, Jim

6th October 2010, 05:54 AM	#4
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	BEAUTIFUL WORKMANSHIP AND A VERY UNIQUE DAGGER. I AGREE IT IS LIKELY FROM INDIA AND THE TWO HORNS APPEAR TO BE FROM A SMALL ANTELOPE CALLED BLACKBUCK WHICH IS FOUND IN INDIA AND USED FOR A FEW WEAPONS AS JIM MENTIONED. THE HANDLE APPEARS TO HAVE COME FROM A LARGER HORN MOST LIKELY WATER BUFFALOW. CONGRADULATIONS.

6th October 2010, 06:07 AM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Beautiful silver work! What a piece!

6th October 2010, 07:34 AM	#6
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	Blackbuck horns are indeed used on the weapons known as fakir's horns. I will post a picture of my pair. They are not all that small. They can grow quite large. But these are obviously smaller.