javanese or chinese??

ferrylaki · 27th September 2007, 02:33 AM

I saw this tipe of sword in Jakarta, Indonesia. I'd like to know where it came from, since it doesnt seem like an Indonesia/javanese sword. there is a sword dealer I'm going to meet regarding to this sword. I intend to buy the sword which is in better condition than thiss pictures shows.

it has double edges. very sharp. wide from the bottom is 4,5 cm and 3 cm to the top.
any comment would be apreciated.
Thank you
best regard,
Ferry ( Jakarta, Indonesia)

David · 27th September 2007, 02:30 PM

It looks Indonesian to me. What about makes you think it is not. Some better and closer pics of the motifs in the metal work on the sheath might tell something.

Henk · 27th September 2007, 07:22 PM

It is indonesian and probably from Java. It has a pamor blade. This sword is called a pedang lurus.

I cann't discover anything chinese on it.

David · 27th September 2007, 07:32 PM

Pedang lurus is what i would call it as well Henk.

A. G. Maisey · 27th September 2007, 10:27 PM

From what I can see in the pics, I also am of the opinion that this is Javanese.

Yes , it is a straight sword (pedang lurus), but I would be inclined to name it "pedang suduk" (stabbing sword).

ferrylaki · 28th September 2007, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

From what I can see in the pics, I also am of the opinion that this is Javanese.

Yes , it is a straight sword (pedang lurus), but I would be inclined to name it "pedang suduk" (stabbing sword).

Thanks guys,
I'll get some better pictures as soon as I recieve the sword.
I'd like to know , should I stain the blade to show the pamor or just clean it and put some oil on it?
regards,
FERRY

David · 28th September 2007, 04:02 AM

I believe that the Jawanese tradition would be to clean and stain it.

ferrylaki · 28th September 2007, 04:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

I believe that the Jawanese tradition would be to clean and stain it.

stain it. gonna ruin the edge since it still has a straight and sharp edge.(not the sword in the picture)
I cant find any suitable scabbard design. in the pictures I posted seem too chinese. any idea?

regards,
FERRY

David · 28th September 2007, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ferrylaki

stain it. gonna ruin the edge since it still has a straight and sharp edge.(not the sword in the picture)
I cant find any suitable scabbard design. in the pictures I posted seem too chinese. any idea?

I am confused. Staining would not necessarily ruin the edge of the blade. And what sword are we talking about if not the one in the picture?
What seems too Chinese about this scabbard?

A. G. Maisey · 28th September 2007, 11:43 PM

OK Ferry, I'm tuned in to you.

The sword you saw in Jakarta is SIMILAR TO the sword of which you posted a picture.

Understood.

I think you confused us a little --- or maybe we confused ourselves.

When you actually have the sword you intend to purchase, in your hands, how about if you give us a picture of it, and we can comment on the actual sword you are talking about, instead of one similar to it?

That scabbard of which you posted a picture does not look Chinese to my eyes.With that kepet, it looks Madurese. I cannot see the motif in the brass work very clearly. Is it a Chinese motif? If so, it might have been put together by a gentleman of Chinese descent, living in Madura, or perhaps East Jawa, around Surabaya.

If in fact the sword you will purchase is Javanese, it should be stained. Done correctly this will not damage the edge.

If I were to order a scabbard for this type of blade I would probably opt for a scabbard without metal fittings. Probably akasia wood with good serat nginden, buntut sungu, and sungu at the mouth of the scabbard. The two pieces of sungu should be fitted in such a way that the wood penetrates the sungu and the sungu serves to add strength to the joint of the wood. If you can get a tukang wrongko to make the wood as terusan, rather than sambungan, this would be best, but the wood should still penetrate the sungu.

If you need to get the handle made too, there are a number of designs you could use. I rather like that dove pattern on the sword you have shown a photo of.

27th September 2007, 02:33 AM	#1
ferrylaki Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 285	javanese or chinese?? I saw this tipe of sword in Jakarta, Indonesia. I'd like to know where it came from, since it doesnt seem like an Indonesia/javanese sword. there is a sword dealer I'm going to meet regarding to this sword. I intend to buy the sword which is in better condition than thiss pictures shows. it has double edges. very sharp. wide from the bottom is 4,5 cm and 3 cm to the top. any comment would be apreciated. Thank you best regard, Ferry ( Jakarta, Indonesia) Attached Images

27th September 2007, 02:30 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	It looks Indonesian to me. What about makes you think it is not. Some better and closer pics of the motifs in the metal work on the sheath might tell something.

27th September 2007, 07:22 PM	#3
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	It is indonesian and probably from Java. It has a pamor blade. This sword is called a pedang lurus. I cann't discover anything chinese on it.

27th September 2007, 07:32 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	Pedang lurus is what i would call it as well Henk.

27th September 2007, 10:27 PM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	From what I can see in the pics, I also am of the opinion that this is Javanese. Yes , it is a straight sword (pedang lurus), but I would be inclined to name it "pedang suduk" (stabbing sword).

28th September 2007, 04:02 AM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	I believe that the Jawanese tradition would be to clean and stain it.

28th September 2007, 11:43 PM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	OK Ferry, I'm tuned in to you. The sword you saw in Jakarta is SIMILAR TO the sword of which you posted a picture. Understood. I think you confused us a little --- or maybe we confused ourselves. When you actually have the sword you intend to purchase, in your hands, how about if you give us a picture of it, and we can comment on the actual sword you are talking about, instead of one similar to it? That scabbard of which you posted a picture does not look Chinese to my eyes.With that kepet, it looks Madurese. I cannot see the motif in the brass work very clearly. Is it a Chinese motif? If so, it might have been put together by a gentleman of Chinese descent, living in Madura, or perhaps East Jawa, around Surabaya. If in fact the sword you will purchase is Javanese, it should be stained. Done correctly this will not damage the edge. If I were to order a scabbard for this type of blade I would probably opt for a scabbard without metal fittings. Probably akasia wood with good serat nginden, buntut sungu, and sungu at the mouth of the scabbard. The two pieces of sungu should be fitted in such a way that the wood penetrates the sungu and the sungu serves to add strength to the joint of the wood. If you can get a tukang wrongko to make the wood as terusan, rather than sambungan, this would be best, but the wood should still penetrate the sungu. If you need to get the handle made too, there are a number of designs you could use. I rather like that dove pattern on the sword you have shown a photo of.