Turkish NCO (?) WW1 Sword.

katana · 1st February 2010, 01:53 PM

Hi
just bought this Turkish Officer's sword. The inscription is 'old' Turkish script and was used up to the end of WW1 ....after which they changed their alphabet to the latin characters. The inscription reads... 'Allah (god) is with us/me'.

Spear pointed and double edged ... all the descriptions of these swords state that the hilts are wooden .......mine is horn and almost certainly Rhino

which suggests to me perhaps the officer was a CO or higher rank ?
The 68cms (26 3/4") long blade is of good quality steel, diamond cross section, seems to be a very small "I" or a 'sideways' "H" stamp next to the guard. I believe the better blades were supplied by Germany (Solingen ?).

Came with a scabbard with a damaged end. The throat is much larger than the blade, so likely a later replacement ? Wooden core with brown leather similar to the British type used during WW1.

All comments and info greatly received, thank you

Regards David

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fernando · 1st February 2010, 05:35 PM

Nice

.
Beautiful inscription

.
Look at me ... envious

.
Fernando

Zwielicht · 1st February 2010, 06:14 PM

Nice thing!

fernando · 1st February 2010, 06:22 PM

Say David,
Are the guard, ferrule and pommel in iron?
That dark shade ... is it patina, or some kind of finish?
Fernando

katana · 1st February 2010, 07:21 PM

Thank you Fernando and Zwielicht for your kind comments.

'Nando the guard, pommel etc is brass, with dark patination over most of them. Some areas looked to have been cleaned quite some time ago, and whilst cleaning the blade this patination was 'wiped' (not deliberately

)and is a little shinier.

There are nicks to the blade......which are very old.....perhaps these occured during the 'Great War' ....hard to say. It certainly has seen some 'action'. I have read that these swords were actually used in the trenches....some were shortened to make them effective 'trench knives', the guard making a useful 'knuckle-duster'.

I have also read that bayonets, swords and knives were often utilised in combat as the Turks often suffered ammunition supply problems, but were still expected to attack 'enemy' positions

Kind Regards David

Zifir · 1st February 2010, 09:01 PM

The inscription is especially interesting, showing how far the German influence on Turkish military went during that time. `Allah bizimle' is a direct translation of famous German military slogan of the Second (and later the Third) Reich: 'Gott mit uns'.

fernando · 1st February 2010, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zifir

The inscription is especially interesting, showing how far the German influence on Turkish military went during that time. `Allah bizimle' is a direct translation of famous German military slogan of the Second (and later the Third) Reich: 'Gott mit uns'.

I´ll be damned

Fernando

1st February 2010, 01:53 PM	#1
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Turkish NCO (?) WW1 Sword. Hi just bought this Turkish Officer's sword. The inscription is 'old' Turkish script and was used up to the end of WW1 ....after which they changed their alphabet to the latin characters. The inscription reads... 'Allah (god) is with us/me'. Spear pointed and double edged ... all the descriptions of these swords state that the hilts are wooden .......mine is horn and almost certainly Rhino which suggests to me perhaps the officer was a CO or higher rank ? The 68cms (26 3/4") long blade is of good quality steel, diamond cross section, seems to be a very small "I" or a 'sideways' "H" stamp next to the guard. I believe the better blades were supplied by Germany (Solingen ?). Came with a scabbard with a damaged end. The throat is much larger than the blade, so likely a later replacement ? Wooden core with brown leather similar to the British type used during WW1. All comments and info greatly received, thank you Regards David . Attached Images Last edited by katana; 1st February 2010 at 02:50 PM.

1st February 2010, 05:35 PM	#2
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,642	Nice . Beautiful inscription . Look at me ... envious . Fernando

1st February 2010, 06:14 PM	#3
Zwielicht Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 26	Nice thing!

1st February 2010, 06:22 PM	#4
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,642	Say David, Are the guard, ferrule and pommel in iron? That dark shade ... is it patina, or some kind of finish? Fernando

1st February 2010, 07:21 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Thank you Fernando and Zwielicht for your kind comments. 'Nando the guard, pommel etc is brass, with dark patination over most of them. Some areas looked to have been cleaned quite some time ago, and whilst cleaning the blade this patination was 'wiped' (not deliberately )and is a little shinier. There are nicks to the blade......which are very old.....perhaps these occured during the 'Great War' ....hard to say. It certainly has seen some 'action'. I have read that these swords were actually used in the trenches....some were shortened to make them effective 'trench knives', the guard making a useful 'knuckle-duster'. I have also read that bayonets, swords and knives were often utilised in combat as the Turks often suffered ammunition supply problems, but were still expected to attack 'enemy' positions Kind Regards David

1st February 2010, 09:01 PM	#6
Zifir Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Istanbul Posts: 228	The inscription is especially interesting, showing how far the German influence on Turkish military went during that time. `Allah bizimle' is a direct translation of famous German military slogan of the Second (and later the Third) Reich: 'Gott mit uns'.