help to identify this short weapon

ferrylaki · 25th January 2007, 07:57 AM

hii all...
can any body help me to identify this weapon???
seem to have horn handle and its very sharp...rusty .

FenrisWolf · 25th January 2007, 09:07 AM

I've seen these on ebay a number of times; it's a klewang, a Phillipine short sword. I don't know a lot about them beyond that, but the blade on this looks a bit better than average. There appear to be forging patterns under the rust.

kronckew · 25th January 2007, 11:22 AM

definitely a klewang, see this linky for more info: Linky to eth. weapons research site
particularly, click the 'swords' pic, klewangs are halfway down the next page...

Henk · 25th January 2007, 07:50 PM

Looks like a luwuk. A javanese short sword.
Is that a pamor blade?

David · 25th January 2007, 08:01 PM

Call me crazy, but that hilt looks suspiciously Sumatran to me.

I think this is an Indonesian weapon, not from the Philippines.

A. G. Maisey · 25th January 2007, 08:38 PM

If I look at this I see a pedang luwuk.

The handle is a form that is not uncommon in Central Jawa.

The scabbard is typical of low quality items of this type.

Ferrylaki has told us that he is located in Central Jawa.

In 40 years of visiting Central Jawa I cannot recall ever having seen a single weapon from the Philippines.

Pedang luwuk, Jawa Tengah.

FenrisWolf · 25th January 2007, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

If I look at this I see a pedang luwuk.

The handle is a form that is not uncommon in Central Jawa.

The scabbard is typical of low quality items of this type.

Ferrylaki has told us that he is located in Central Jawa.

In 40 years of visiting Central Jawa I cannot recall ever having seen a single weapon from the Philippines.

Pedang luwuk, Jawa Tengah.

That would explain the difference in the blades. Form follows function so it's not surprising that there would be similarities in the overall shape, but weapons from the Phillipines are not normally noted for having visible pamor like this.

Fenris

ferrylaki · 26th January 2007, 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henk

Looks like a luwuk. A javanese short sword.
Is that a pamor blade?

the sword 40 cm over all...I've seen this kind of handle in sumatran sword in the threat posted by utami...the iron seem different from other javanese sword such as pedang pamor... but in my blade seem it is not pamored...only the forging pattern.

A. G. Maisey · 26th January 2007, 08:36 PM

I find it interesting that you have seen this handle form on Sumatran swords, Ferrylaki. I have only seen this handle form associated with Javanese weapons.

I have checked all recent posts by Utami , and I'm afraid I cannot find a picture of this handle form on a Sumatran sword.

I would appreciate it if you could please provide the date of the post where this handle form can be seen on a Sumatran sword.

Thanks.

Battara · 27th January 2007, 07:48 PM

Not PI/Moro for sure, but I could go with Sumatra. Yes both have pamors, though Java and other Indonesian pieces usually have a rougher texture than PI/Moro ones.

ferrylaki · 29th January 2007, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

I find it interesting that you have seen this handle form on Sumatran swords, Ferrylaki. I have only seen this handle form associated with Javanese weapons.

I have checked all recent posts by Utami , and I'm afraid I cannot find a picture of this handle form on a Sumatran sword.

I would appreciate it if you could please provide the date of the post where this handle form can be seen on a Sumatran sword.

Thanks.

see this pictures...about utami's post, I forgot whre I saw it. but I do remember he post many pictures from National Museum of Indonesia....

the first pic show silver colour handle which belong to a west java sword...

second pic is a sumatran stile with VOC sword....as it told.

A. G. Maisey · 29th January 2007, 04:00 AM

Thank you very much, Ferrylaki.

I can see photos of two swords,and the handles do have some resemblance to the handle on the sword under discussion, but you have not provided a reference of any type that could confirm these photos as being of swords from Sumatera, or Sunda.

They may well be from Sumatera, or from Sunda---or from Jawa.

Can you provide references?

ferrylaki · 29th January 2007, 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Thank you very much, Ferrylaki.

I can see photos of two swords,and the handles do have some resemblance to the handle on the sword under discussion, but you have not provided a reference of any type that could confirm these photos as being of swords from Sumatera, or Sunda.

They may well be from Sumatera, or from Sunda---or from Jawa.

Can you provide references?

please see this site ... http://old.blades.free.fr/
you may find several kind of pedang sabet that I ment before.

A. G. Maisey · 29th January 2007, 06:18 AM

Thank you for that reference Ferrylaki.

As I said previously:- interesting.

Still, the fact remains that I have only ever seen this handle associated with pedang that could be attributed to Jawa.

If the form can indeed be found as widely dispersed as Jawa, Sunda, and Sumatera, then it causes one to wonder why.

Incidentally, in an earlier post you mentioned that you were located in Solo. May I enquire as to what part of Solo?

ferrylaki · 29th January 2007, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Thank you for that reference Ferrylaki.

As I said previously:- interesting.

Still, the fact remains that I have only ever seen this handle associated with pedang that could be attributed to Jawa.

If the form can indeed be found as widely dispersed as Jawa, Sunda, and Sumatera, then it causes one to wonder why.

Incidentally, in an earlier post you mentioned that you were located in Solo. May I enquire as to what part of Solo?

the exact location you mean?
solo/surakarta.....KERTEN...Panti Waloyo Horpital...

A. G. Maisey · 29th January 2007, 11:20 AM

Thanks Ferrylaki.

That's down in Lawiyan, isn't it?
I thought it was Panti Waluyo? I could be wrong, only ever been past it.

Nearest I ever lived to that was in Kratonan, these days I`m out at Palur when I'm in Solo.

ferrylaki · 31st January 2007, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Thanks Ferrylaki.

That's down in Lawiyan, isn't it?
I thought it was Panti Waluyo? I could be wrong, only ever been past it.

Nearest I ever lived to that was in Kratonan, these days I`m out at Palur when I'm in Solo.

palur.....same as my mother. what street???? I'm in jeruk

A. G. Maisey · 31st January 2007, 07:50 AM

In Perum RC.Just shifted from Renyeb, near Mesjid Al Falaah.

Currently getting a new place organised but not yet sure exactly where it will be. Contract ran out on the other one.It'll still be somewhere in that area though. Maybe in the next RT.Palur Griya Asri, I think.

ferrylaki · 31st January 2007, 09:42 AM

[QUOTE=A. G. Maisey]In Perum RC.Just shifted from Renyeb, near Mesjid Al Falaah.

Currently getting a new place organised but not yet sure exactly where it will be. Contract ran out on the other one.It'll still be somewhere in that area though. Maybe in the next RT.Palur Griya Asri, I think

are you an Indonesian?
I grew up in palur...I have a friend in karawitan, also a school mate named Bondan which is a dalang I guess.

ferrylaki · 31st January 2007, 10:17 AM

[QUOTE=ferrylaki]

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

In Perum RC.Just shifted from Renyeb, near Mesjid Al Falaah.

Currently getting a new place organised but not yet sure exactly where it will be. Contract ran out on the other one.It'll still be somewhere in that area though. Maybe in the next RT.Palur Griya Asri, I think

are you an Indonesian?
I grew up in palur...I have a friend in karawitan, also a school mate named Bondan which is a dalang I guess.

do you know a keris trader named SALEH lives in Laweyan?
I'm going to buy some keris from this gentlemen. there's thousand of kerises in his house....my friend said that way...

A. G. Maisey · 31st January 2007, 08:05 PM

No Ferrylaki, not Indonesian, Australian, but I have been spending time in Indonesia, mostly Solo, every year for about 40 years.Two of my children were born in Indonesia, my wife is Indonesian, and I have family spread across Jawa and Bali.

Yes, I know of Saleh, but have never dealt with him.

ferrylaki · 1st February 2007, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

No Ferrylaki, not Indonesian, Australian, but I have been spending time in Indonesia, mostly Solo, every year for about 40 years.Two of my children were born in Indonesia, my wife is Indonesian, and I have family spread across Jawa and Bali.

Yes, I know of Saleh, but have never dealt with him.

may I have your email adress???

A. G. Maisey · 1st February 2007, 04:03 AM

Yep.

Check your private messages.

ferrylaki · 1st February 2007, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Yep.

Check your private messages.

I notice that this luwuk sword did not grinded...or no grinding effect on its edge.
but it is very sharp indeed.
I'm courious how they were made???
and the iron is seem flashy...if you look at the pic, it is shiny. not like other pamor javanese sword I ever seen before.
the pamor line also look different than others.not a line, not a motive.
on the edge you can see there is some part(point part) like peeling away or the outer layer is loosing.

25th January 2007, 07:57 AM	#1
ferrylaki Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 285	help to identify this short weapon hii all... can any body help me to identify this weapon??? seem to have horn handle and its very sharp...rusty . Attached Images

25th January 2007, 09:07 AM	#2
FenrisWolf Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 181	I've seen these on ebay a number of times; it's a klewang, a Phillipine short sword. I don't know a lot about them beyond that, but the blade on this looks a bit better than average. There appear to be forging patterns under the rust.

25th January 2007, 11:22 AM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	definitely a klewang, see this linky for more info: Linky to eth. weapons research site particularly, click the 'swords' pic, klewangs are halfway down the next page...

25th January 2007, 07:50 PM	#4
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	Looks like a luwuk. A javanese short sword. Is that a pamor blade?

25th January 2007, 08:01 PM	#5
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	Call me crazy, but that hilt looks suspiciously Sumatran to me. I think this is an Indonesian weapon, not from the Philippines.

25th January 2007, 08:38 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	If I look at this I see a pedang luwuk. The handle is a form that is not uncommon in Central Jawa. The scabbard is typical of low quality items of this type. Ferrylaki has told us that he is located in Central Jawa. In 40 years of visiting Central Jawa I cannot recall ever having seen a single weapon from the Philippines. Pedang luwuk, Jawa Tengah.

26th January 2007, 08:36 PM	#9
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	I find it interesting that you have seen this handle form on Sumatran swords, Ferrylaki. I have only seen this handle form associated with Javanese weapons. I have checked all recent posts by Utami , and I'm afraid I cannot find a picture of this handle form on a Sumatran sword. I would appreciate it if you could please provide the date of the post where this handle form can be seen on a Sumatran sword. Thanks.

27th January 2007, 07:48 PM	#10
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Not PI/Moro for sure, but I could go with Sumatra. Yes both have pamors, though Java and other Indonesian pieces usually have a rougher texture than PI/Moro ones.

29th January 2007, 04:00 AM	#12
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Thank you very much, Ferrylaki. I can see photos of two swords,and the handles do have some resemblance to the handle on the sword under discussion, but you have not provided a reference of any type that could confirm these photos as being of swords from Sumatera, or Sunda. They may well be from Sumatera, or from Sunda---or from Jawa. Can you provide references?

29th January 2007, 06:18 AM	#14
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Thank you for that reference Ferrylaki. As I said previously:- interesting. Still, the fact remains that I have only ever seen this handle associated with pedang that could be attributed to Jawa. If the form can indeed be found as widely dispersed as Jawa, Sunda, and Sumatera, then it causes one to wonder why. Incidentally, in an earlier post you mentioned that you were located in Solo. May I enquire as to what part of Solo?

29th January 2007, 11:20 AM	#16
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Thanks Ferrylaki. That's down in Lawiyan, isn't it? I thought it was Panti Waluyo? I could be wrong, only ever been past it. Nearest I ever lived to that was in Kratonan, these days I`m out at Palur when I'm in Solo.

31st January 2007, 07:50 AM	#18
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	In Perum RC.Just shifted from Renyeb, near Mesjid Al Falaah. Currently getting a new place organised but not yet sure exactly where it will be. Contract ran out on the other one.It'll still be somewhere in that area though. Maybe in the next RT.Palur Griya Asri, I think.

31st January 2007, 09:42 AM	#19
ferrylaki Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 285	[QUOTE=A. G. Maisey]In Perum RC.Just shifted from Renyeb, near Mesjid Al Falaah. Currently getting a new place organised but not yet sure exactly where it will be. Contract ran out on the other one.It'll still be somewhere in that area though. Maybe in the next RT.Palur Griya Asri, I think are you an Indonesian? I grew up in palur...I have a friend in karawitan, also a school mate named Bondan which is a dalang I guess.

31st January 2007, 08:05 PM	#21
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	No Ferrylaki, not Indonesian, Australian, but I have been spending time in Indonesia, mostly Solo, every year for about 40 years.Two of my children were born in Indonesia, my wife is Indonesian, and I have family spread across Jawa and Bali. Yes, I know of Saleh, but have never dealt with him.

1st February 2007, 04:03 AM	#23
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Yep. Check your private messages.