Two 17th century Keris at the Power and Fashion Exhibition in Dresden

[Paul Duffy]

May I add my thanks also for sharing this interesting 17th century piece.

I recently saw some keris in Paris at the La Musee de L'Armee, which are also described as 17th century pieces. I'll try to post a photo, but I'd be interested in any comments on these keris

[rasdan]

Thank you very much for posting these pictures, Tatyana. I really appreciate it.

[A. G. Maisey]

Re your post 11 David, yes, you are correct, but I tend to think in terms of Sulawesi = Bugis. Wrong, I know. Ideally I should think in terms of ethnic groups:- Bugis, Makassarese, Toraja, Mandar, but I don't, principally because I have very little interest in keris that come from outside the core areas of Jawa and Bali. Rightly or wrongly I tend to think of keris from outside the core areas as "keris-like objects". I guess I have been corrupted by too much contact with old-time, hardline Javanese and Balinese gentlemen.

[kai]

Hello Alan,

The regalia of Bone also include the keris La Makkawe which is obviously based on the same style (scabbard with possibly later repairs); Gowa still retains keris I Daeng Tammacinna (as does its tributary Bima as mentioned above). Given that poor copies of these royal keris are also known from the Toraja, I believe it stands to reason that this style was once known all over Sulawesi Selantan.

I believe the jury is still out on the question whether this type of scabbard and, especially, hilt (including its selut) really are an indigenous Sulawesi style or how much they owe to Jawa: All the early examples surviving in European collections seem to come with blades that IMVHO could well be royal gifts from Jawa. We know that keris with this style of selut were also awarded by Aceh royalty to tributary Gayo rulers; and also the recent finds from the Malay peninsula look pretty convincing. Given the obvious pre-Islamic iconography on scabbard and hilt, which period would be most likely for developing (and distributing) this style of fittings and from where? Since Islam got kinda added to the already present beliefs rather than superseding them, there is not any clear cut-off date; it is noteworthy though that Aceh and Gowa/Bone belonged to the sultanates with very active proselytizing efforts...

Achim Weihrauch (2001) cites pangeran Hardjonagoro that this hilt may be of South Sumatran origin ("Palembang, Melayu, Jambi") but doesn't reveal the reasons for this hypothesis.

BTW, the keris kindly shown here by Tatyana is indeed from the Ruestkammer Dresden display and you may have not been able to examine it during your visit. Really good pics of the blade as well as its fittings can be found in his thesis (Fig. 41-43 - also have a look at the following Figs!).

Regards,
Kai

[kai]

Here is the link for downloading Achim Weihrauch's thesis (2001):
http://ificah.de/wp-content/uploads/...schen-Kris.pdf
(Even if your German language skills are poor or non-existent, the pics alone are certainly worth the effort!)

Some more downloads available here:
http://ificah.de/open-access/

Regards,
Kai

[A. G. Maisey]

Many thanks for your comments Kai.

Regrettably I do not share the enthusiasm of the bulk of collectors for these keris that originate from outside the core keris areas of Jawa and Bali. As I commented in post 14 my interest is not really directed in the same way as the interest of other people.

To my mind there is not the smallest doubt that the overall form of rectangular scabbard upper section is originally Javanese, there is ample monumental evidence for this. However, with that form as a starting point, various interpretations occurred in other places. I'm sure that this is of interest to many people, but it is of virtually no real interest to me. It occurred --- so?

I knew Panembahan Harjonegoro (Alm.) personally over a number of years. I would much prefer not to discuss him, or even raise his name. It is best that he rest in peace.

I am familiar with Achim Weihrauch's thesis, but I cannot read it. All the material in the photos I am very familiar with, and judging by the length of this thesis it should be a very worthwhile contribution to keris literature. Regrettably I have only had rather mixed reports in respect of it, and I can offer no personal opinion nor comment at all. I really hope I do not die before it gets put into English, I would very much like to examine this work closely and form my own opinion, instead of relying on the opinions of other people, which may or may not be objective and justified.

Yes, I did not photograph nor examine this keris, as I said, I believe it may have been on display in the Rüstkammer, rather than in the holdings kept in the warehouse. I used the word "may", because I was told by the curator with whom I dealt that the keris on display do change from time to time. If it was on display I would have seen it there, but I have forgotten seeing it.

I feel I owe an explanation for my disinterest in keris from outside the core areas. At one time in my life I was very interested in keris from everywhere, I made no distinction between Javanese, Balinese, Peninsula or any other keris. Every keris --- even those things from the Philippines -- drew my interest. I was primarily a collector. As I learnt more, and very particularly, as I adopted a Javanese set of standards I realised that all keris are not equal, nor do they enshrine the same essence. As cultural artifacts all keris are probably worthy of the same attention, but one lifetime is insufficient time to give all keris the same degree of attention. I have chosen to focus on only one small aspect of one small area. Its called "specialisation", learning more and more about less and less.

[kai]

Hello Alan,

To my mind there is not the smallest doubt that the overall form of rectangular scabbard upper section is originally Javanese, there is ample monumental evidence for this. However, with that form as a starting point, various interpretations occurred in other places.

Yes, this is certainly correct considering the early evidence from stone carvings; the same seems to hold for this type of selut, too. IMHO the same can be reasonably assumed for the hilt type (no extant examples in early stone carving; several examples in early European collections which seem to originate from Jawa rather than Sulawesi though). Thus, I am also considering whether this scabbard might be a Jawa import rather than a genuine Sulawesi development? This might even include iconic parts like the toli toli - just playing devil's advocate here!

OTOH, Achim Weihrauch points to the coarse rattan binding at the scabbard stem of Sulawesi swords which resembles what we see in these keris scabbards which may suggest a local development.

I am familiar with Achim Weihrauch's thesis, but I cannot read it. All the material in the photos I am very familiar with, and judging by the length of this thesis it should be a very worthwhile contribution to keris literature.

I'd second that it would be great if a (preferably updated/extended) English version were to be published...

I feel I owe an explanation for my disinterest in keris from outside the core areas. At one time in my life I was very interested in keris from everywhere, I made no distinction between Javanese, Balinese, Peninsula or any other keris. Every keris --- even those things from the Philippines -- drew my interest. I was primarily a collector. As I learnt more, and very particularly, as I adopted a Javanese set of standards I realised that all keris are not equal, nor do they enshrine the same essence. As cultural artifacts all keris are probably worthy of the same attention, but one lifetime is insufficient time to give all keris the same degree of attention.

Yes, I do understand your priorities here.

I hoped the blades - which appear to be invariably of Jawa extraction - would pretty much fall within your scope though. Based on the better quality pics in the thesis would you be prepared to comment on the origin of this keris blade?

Regards,
Kai