Yataghan or Flyssa?

kronckew · 24th September 2016, 12:29 PM

just won this at an online auction in norfolk, uk.
listed as: 19th Century North African Flyssa sword with scabbard a/f

i seriously doubt that.

no dimensions, no significant bidders, i won it for less than the packing & postage. it appears to be a turkish (no integral bolster) style karakulak yataghan with silver fittings, now black. scabbard chape may be missing, leather need a bit of TLC near the throat. blade looks laminated, with a indented stamp on the left side. pommel may have some silver-work, as well as some worm holes. will know more when it arrives. i do know it's NOT a flyssa.

(they sold another 'flyssa' a few lots before that looked suspiciously like a salawar yataghan (khyber knife) for not much more than i am paying)...

will list more info on arrival.

ilias · 24th September 2016, 01:01 PM

A nice yataghan.
Congratulations!!!

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 24th September 2016, 01:37 PM

Can someone please outline the difference between a Turkish Yatagan and a Greek Yatagan? Is there a stamp on this blade?

kronckew · 24th September 2016, 01:40 PM

i read elsewhere here that the balkan ones, like my bulgarian one, have integral bolsters, where the turkish ones do not, having a seperate bolster that extends decoratively up the blade for a short bit. not sure abput that tho. i'm sure someone will comment.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 24th September 2016, 01:43 PM

My assumption is that there is no difference but that it signifies generally Ottoman...or at the time Greece was a protectorate of the Ottoman Empire...

ariel · 25th September 2016, 01:58 AM

There was no "Greece" till 1821. Just as there was no Serbia, and no "Bulgaria" till 1908 ( in 1878 they got an autonomous state).
Integral bolsters were specific for Bulgarian karakulaks and Zeibek Yataghans. The rest had thin hollow bolsters similar to Afghani khybers. There are very few minor decorative features attributing yataghans to specific localities: all silver nielloed , small-eared Cretan, smooth round corals from Foca, karabela-like handles from North Africa... Blades were made everywhere, but mainly in Anatolia and Bosnia and sold en masse. Very few are signed with Christian names or Gregorian dates.

Kronckew's question is superficiously simple ( it is a yataghan, not a flyssa), but older flyssa did have a yataghan-like appearance, suggesting their origin.
And I am not surprised that Brits called Khybers Salavar (mutilated Selaava) Yataghans: many of them do have recurved blades. This begs a question.....:-))))

24th September 2016, 12:29 PM	#1
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	Yataghan or Flyssa? just won this at an online auction in norfolk, uk. listed as: 19th Century North African Flyssa sword with scabbard a/f i seriously doubt that. no dimensions, no significant bidders, i won it for less than the packing & postage. it appears to be a turkish (no integral bolster) style karakulak yataghan with silver fittings, now black. scabbard chape may be missing, leather need a bit of TLC near the throat. blade looks laminated, with a indented stamp on the left side. pommel may have some silver-work, as well as some worm holes. will know more when it arrives. i do know it's NOT a flyssa. (they sold another 'flyssa' a few lots before that looked suspiciously like a salawar yataghan (khyber knife) for not much more than i am paying)... will list more info on arrival. Attached Images

24th September 2016, 01:01 PM	#2
ilias Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: GREECE Posts: 73	A nice yataghan. Congratulations!!!

24th September 2016, 01:37 PM	#3
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Can someone please outline the difference between a Turkish Yatagan and a Greek Yatagan? Is there a stamp on this blade?

24th September 2016, 01:40 PM	#4
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	i read elsewhere here that the balkan ones, like my bulgarian one, have integral bolsters, where the turkish ones do not, having a seperate bolster that extends decoratively up the blade for a short bit. not sure abput that tho. i'm sure someone will comment.

24th September 2016, 01:43 PM	#5
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	My assumption is that there is no difference but that it signifies generally Ottoman...or at the time Greece was a protectorate of the Ottoman Empire...

25th September 2016, 01:58 AM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	There was no "Greece" till 1821. Just as there was no Serbia, and no "Bulgaria" till 1908 ( in 1878 they got an autonomous state). Integral bolsters were specific for Bulgarian karakulaks and Zeibek Yataghans. The rest had thin hollow bolsters similar to Afghani khybers. There are very few minor decorative features attributing yataghans to specific localities: all silver nielloed , small-eared Cretan, smooth round corals from Foca, karabela-like handles from North Africa... Blades were made everywhere, but mainly in Anatolia and Bosnia and sold en masse. Very few are signed with Christian names or Gregorian dates. Kronckew's question is superficiously simple ( it is a yataghan, not a flyssa), but older flyssa did have a yataghan-like appearance, suggesting their origin. And I am not surprised that Brits called Khybers Salavar (mutilated Selaava) Yataghans: many of them do have recurved blades. This begs a question.....:-))))