Little help on this Knife Please

clockwork · 26th December 2008, 01:23 PM

I just picked up this piece in Morocco. I was told that it is 19th century and is from Iran. The writing goes along this line (God besiege your protection and we ask you fend against bad intentions the protector the forgiver you almighty) it is from the koran if anyone can give me a better translation would be thankful. there are seven variations in the blade think they represent the steps to heaven but again not sure. What are your thoughts and opinions on this blade. And thanks in advance for all the help given on this thread.

clockwork · 26th December 2008, 01:48 PM

I will upload a few more pics later later.

clockwork · 26th December 2008, 02:00 PM

few more pics

clockwork · 26th December 2008, 02:12 PM

cpl and will add one or two more in the future

Lew · 26th December 2008, 04:57 PM

The blade shows a chevron pattern. Could be Indian and not Iranian? You really should try and resize (make them smaller) your pics before posting them so they can be viewed more easily.

Lew

Rick · 26th December 2008, 05:25 PM

Welded or etched ?

On picture size; the optimal size is 1024X768 .

That will eliminate having to scroll .

Lew · 26th December 2008, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Welded or etched ?

On picture size; the optimal size is 1024X768 .

That will eliminate having to scroll .

Seems etched to me there are irregular lines on the areas where the welds would be.

Lew

clockwork · 26th December 2008, 06:48 PM

Lew do you think that this is a 19th century knife or would you say it looks newer

Rick · 26th December 2008, 08:31 PM

The goldwork is in very good condition .

clockwork · 27th December 2008, 01:21 AM

most of it is except the ones on the very back of the handle are worn

Lew · 27th December 2008, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clockwork

Lew do you think that this is a 19th century knife or would you say it looks newer

Late 19th I would think.

Lew

ariel · 27th December 2008, 05:29 PM

I think it is a composite: the blade is older and the chevron pattern presupposes some wootz segments ( absolutely needs to be etched). This, AFAIK, ws done by welding, and the irregular lines suggest a second rate job: the smith could not keep the welds linear. Nevertheless, chevrons are attractive. The handle and the decoration are newer, IMHO. I would not be surprised if they were quite recent, from India or Syria: they have well-oiled "restoring" operations there.

fernando · 27th December 2008, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Welded or etched ?

On picture size; the optimal size is 1024X768 .

That will eliminate having to scroll .

Isn't 1024 too wide ? Or is it because i use a laptop ? 800 seems to be the maximum width for me

.
Fernando

Rick · 27th December 2008, 06:58 PM

test desktop .

Rick · 27th December 2008, 06:59 PM

Must be the laptop .

fernando · 27th December 2008, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Must be the laptop .

fernando · 27th December 2008, 09:51 PM

Tony, i have sent you a PM.
Fernando

clockwork · 27th December 2008, 11:03 PM

Thanks sent U a reply

Atlantia · 27th December 2008, 11:36 PM

Hi Clockwork,

I have to say I dont think this one is very old.
I agree there are 19thC chevron etched blades, but I don't think this looks like one. I think the etching looks fairly modern (I see similar ones with very rough edges to the etching quite often) and it looks like someone has tried to clean or polish the blade to remove it. The koftgari looks new and the blue colouration of the handle would rub off very quickly in use or with age.
I see very similar 'new' daggers for sale on indian sites now, I think this one is no more than about 20 years old.
Sorry.

Regards
Gene

Heres a brand new one which is similar, I can find some pics of the chevron bladed ones if you want?

26th December 2008, 01:23 PM	#1
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	Little help on this Knife Please I just picked up this piece in Morocco. I was told that it is 19th century and is from Iran. The writing goes along this line (God besiege your protection and we ask you fend against bad intentions the protector the forgiver you almighty) it is from the koran if anyone can give me a better translation would be thankful. there are seven variations in the blade think they represent the steps to heaven but again not sure. What are your thoughts and opinions on this blade. And thanks in advance for all the help given on this thread. Attached Images

26th December 2008, 02:00 PM	#3
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	few more pics Attached Images

26th December 2008, 02:12 PM	#4
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	cpl and will add one or two more in the future Attached Images

27th December 2008, 06:58 PM	#14
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,262	Test test desktop . Attached Images

27th December 2008, 11:36 PM	#19
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Hi Clockwork, I have to say I dont think this one is very old. I agree there are 19thC chevron etched blades, but I don't think this looks like one. I think the etching looks fairly modern (I see similar ones with very rough edges to the etching quite often) and it looks like someone has tried to clean or polish the blade to remove it. The koftgari looks new and the blue colouration of the handle would rub off very quickly in use or with age. I see very similar 'new' daggers for sale on indian sites now, I think this one is no more than about 20 years old. Sorry. Regards Gene Heres a brand new one which is similar, I can find some pics of the chevron bladed ones if you want? Last edited by Atlantia; 28th December 2008 at 01:57 AM.

26th December 2008, 01:48 PM	#2
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	I will upload a few more pics later later.

26th December 2008, 04:57 PM	#5
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	The blade shows a chevron pattern. Could be Indian and not Iranian? You really should try and resize (make them smaller) your pics before posting them so they can be viewed more easily. Lew

26th December 2008, 05:25 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,262	Welded or etched ? On picture size; the optimal size is 1024X768 . That will eliminate having to scroll .

26th December 2008, 06:48 PM	#8
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	Lew do you think that this is a 19th century knife or would you say it looks newer

26th December 2008, 08:31 PM	#9
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,262	The goldwork is in very good condition .

27th December 2008, 01:21 AM	#10
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	most of it is except the ones on the very back of the handle are worn

27th December 2008, 05:29 PM	#12
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I think it is a composite: the blade is older and the chevron pattern presupposes some wootz segments ( absolutely needs to be etched). This, AFAIK, ws done by welding, and the irregular lines suggest a second rate job: the smith could not keep the welds linear. Nevertheless, chevrons are attractive. The handle and the decoration are newer, IMHO. I would not be surprised if they were quite recent, from India or Syria: they have well-oiled "restoring" operations there.

27th December 2008, 06:59 PM	#15
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,262	Must be the laptop .

27th December 2008, 09:51 PM	#17
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,639	Tony, i have sent you a PM. Fernando

27th December 2008, 11:03 PM	#18
clockwork Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 93	Thanks sent U a reply