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Old 10th April 2016, 06:15 AM   #1
Cathey
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Default Spanish Miquelet belt Pistol with hook

Hi Guys

I am looking for some assistance to identify the maker of this pistol. Guns are not our specialty and whilst we think this may be attributed to the Deop family, we are unsure of the letters on the barrel or the symbol underneath. In the below description we have had best guess, sadly at this stage that is all it is. Any assistance would be gratefully appreciated.

Date: Circa 1780?
Dimensions: Overall length 10 ¾” 27.4 cm, Barrel length from breach 6” 15 cm
Marks, etc: H Deop on lock and gold-filled mark "GAB BON ELY" with a crown on Barrel

Description: A Spanish miquelet-lock pistol, H Deop, circa 1780. Two-stage barrel, octagonal then round after a chiselled acanthus frieze and with a cannon muzzle. Smooth 15 bore in 16 mm calibre. Over the breech silver-inlaid ornaments and a gold-filled mark "GAB BON ELY" with a crown . Engraved lock with what appears to be J H Deop, the side plate with a screw-fastened belt hook. Walnut stock with engraved iron furniture. Wooden ramrod with iron tip, total Length 10 ¾” 27.4 cm.

References:
LAVIN James D A History of Spanish Firearms Pp 219-220


Cheers Cathey and Rex
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Old 10th April 2016, 09:32 AM   #2
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Hello,
I think that is the mark of Pedro CARBONELL (ca 1790) and the other one the town mark of Barcelona.
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Old 10th April 2016, 11:17 AM   #3
fernando
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Good shot, Andreas,
Gunsmith Per (Pedro) Carbonell is listed in quoted Lavins work, page 258 and lock maker Joseph Deop right in next page.
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Old 10th April 2016, 11:23 AM   #4
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I have in my collection a small miquelet pistol which is also made by CABONELL/Barcelona as says the mark on ist barrel. What I have never seen: It has a mark "PEDONEATO"(?)under a crown in recess at the front of the battery. Does anyone know which maker this was?
Many thanks
corrado26
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Old 10th April 2016, 04:17 PM   #5
fernando
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Two things to consider, Corrado, if i may .
Firstly, the name attributed is well placed with a ? question mark; some of those letters may be different, like the E being actually a Z and so; although there is no doubt about the P, but any of the few names started by this letter in Lavin's or Gyngell list, can not be the one in your battery.
Secondly, remote but possible, batteries do wear out and may eventually be replaced with a spare one at hand, not necessarily from the smith who made the original lock.
Let's see if Fernando K comes around; he has far larger possibilities to discern what that name is about.
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Old 10th April 2016, 05:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
batteries do wear out and may eventually be replaced with a spare one at hand, not necessarily from the smith who made the original lock.
I agree with that totally, but the thickness of this battery is 4,95mm so that a wear out would under normal circumstances be expected in a very far future
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Old 11th April 2016, 04:41 PM   #7
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Can't you take a more acurate picture of the battery ?
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Old 11th April 2016, 05:00 PM   #8
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Ok, here are three fotos of the front of the battery. It is very difficult to take good enough fotos of this mark because its letters are very weak. So I hope that the quality is good enough.
Thanks a lot in advance
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Old 12th April 2016, 10:05 AM   #9
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Tentatively, PE(RE) TOR(R)ENTO? (Active Ripoll 1756-1815)
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Old 12th April 2016, 12:32 PM   #10
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Oh yes; i wouldn't even doubt it
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Old 12th April 2016, 01:01 PM   #11
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Andreas and Fernado many thanks, you are really great. Now that I know who made the lock, it was easy to find this gunmaker in the Neue Stöckel.
Thanks a lot once more
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Old 13th April 2016, 09:04 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corrado26
Andreas and Fernado many thanks, you are really great. Now that I know who made the lock, it was easy to find this gunmaker in the Neue Stöckel.
Thanks a lot once more
corrado26
You' re welcome. Here is a description, from an old Christie's auction, of another pistol with a pairing of a Torrento lock and a Carbonell barrel:
A CATALAN MIQUELET-LOCK BLUNDERBUSS-PISTOL BY CARBONELL, BARCELONA
LATE 18TH CENTURY
With blued iron barrel formed in two stages, polygonal and belled towards the muzzle, chiselled with bands of leaves at the muzzle and girdle, the breech section with maker's stamps of Carbonell (Neue Støckel 7217 and 7218) and inlaid with silver scrollwork, lightly engraved blued patilla lock, the outer face of the steel with maker's stamp of Pere Torrento (Neue Støckel 1105), walnut full stock inlaid with pierced engraved silver rococo plaques retained by silver nails, the pommel and fore-end bound with silver bands, belt-hook, and chiselled iron trigger-guard
14in (35.6cm)
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Old 13th April 2016, 03:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
With blued iron barrel formed in two stages, polygonal and belled towards the muzzle, chiselled with bands of leaves at the muzzle and girdle, the breech section with maker's stamps of Carbonell (Neue Støckel 7217 and 7218) and inlaid with silver scrollwork, ......the outer face of the steel with maker's stamp of Pere Torrento (Neue Støckel 1105), walnut full stock

This reads like my pistol with the exception of length and the silver barock plaques. Very interesting and a great help for me.
Thanks a lot
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