Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Ethnographic Weapons
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 5th August 2021, 07:04 PM   #1
thomas hauschild
Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 139
Default Knife (?) with silver inscriptions

Hi

I got this indonesian (?) piece. I like to know a translation of the silver inscription please. Thanks a lot.

Best Thomas
Attached Images
     
thomas hauschild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2021, 02:35 AM   #2
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,219
Default

Almost looks Balinese in form, so yes I think Indonesian would be a good guess.

Hope someone can help with the translation. There is a probability that it is in Jawi, which would mean that although it is in Arabic script, it wouldn't be Arabic.

Another thought, could it be a repurposed Balinese piece?
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2021, 03:29 PM   #3
Ian
Vikingsword Staff
 
Ian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Aussie Bush
Posts: 4,194
Default

Hi Thomas,

I think you have a betel knife that may be from Indonesia but could also be Malaysian or Thai. I am interested to hear what the inscription says.
Ian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 7th August 2021, 08:04 PM   #4
thomas hauschild
Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 139
Default

Heard from a different source, that it is from bali. The inscriptions means ( what I have expected ) more or less „allah is great“ in some more words.

Best Thomas
thomas hauschild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 7th August 2021, 08:45 PM   #5
Oliver Pinchot
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 457
Default

That's pretty much it. One one side is written, Bismillah al Rahman al Rahim (Blessing of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate.)
Oliver Pinchot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2021, 09:23 AM   #6
Klop
Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 63
Default

the inscription is Islamic but the main relegion of Bali is Hinduism, not sure if that is contradictive or regular practice. Anyhow a nice piece!

Kind regards,Eric.
Klop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th August 2021, 01:29 PM   #7
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thomas hauschild View Post
Heard from a different source, that it is from bali. The inscriptions means ( what I have expected ) more or less „allah is great“ in some more words.
Hello Thomas,
It's for sure not Balinese, the form is wrong and "Allah is great" make no sense on an island with mainly Hindu population.

I guess Malaysia or Southern Thailand as origin.

Regards,
Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2021, 04:15 AM   #8
ausjulius
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: musorian territory
Posts: 422
Default

its a good question normally id say pattani . just because of the angled pommel which is common on knives in that area aswel as kedah and yala and. the shape is like knives and tools from lombok and bali though.. but the pommels nearly always are more cone like.. id say southern thailand malay
ausjulius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2021, 04:22 AM   #9
Ian
Vikingsword Staff
 
Ian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Aussie Bush
Posts: 4,194
Default Probably Thai ...

ausjulius and Detlef,

I think you are probably correct to put this on mainland SE Asia. If it is a betel knife, as I suspect, the shape of the blade is fairly typical for the Malaysia/Thai region. It is quite common for betel knives to be "dressed up" with silver, etc. although I don't recall seeing one with such an inscription before. Based on the blade form, I lean towards Thai manufacture. Attached are several examples of Thai betel knives. The first two are from Artzi Yarom's web site. The third is from a well-provenanced authoritative source and published in Henry Brownrigg, Betel Cutters from the Samuel Eilenberg Collection, Thames and Hudson, London 1992, p. 132.
.
Attached Images
   

Last edited by Ian; 10th August 2021 at 04:39 AM. Reason: Added pics
Ian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2021, 02:46 PM   #10
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

Would be great to know the measurements! Thomas??
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th August 2021, 08:24 PM   #11
thomas hauschild
Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 139
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sajen View Post
Would be great to know the measurements! Thomas??
12 cm blade , in total 29 cm. Blade thickness at the spine is 2,5 mm thickest. Very thin and sharp blade. I haven‘t cut (or tasted) a bethel nut in my life. How hard are this kind of nuts ?

Best Thomas

P.s. Detlef I‘m fully vaccinated since month. Let‘s meet and put our fingers on our new acquisitions.
thomas hauschild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2021, 10:08 AM   #12
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thomas hauschild View Post
12 cm blade , in total 29 cm. Blade thickness at the spine is 2,5 mm thickest. Very thin and sharp blade. I haven‘t cut (or tasted) a bethel nut in my life. How hard are this kind of nuts ?

Best Thomas

P.s. Detlef I‘m fully vaccinated since month. Let‘s meet and put our fingers on our new acquisitions.
Hi Thomas,

Thank you for the measurements! I like this knife and like Ian I guess that it could be a betel knife.
Betel gets used in different degrees of hardness of the nut, in India for example gets used the hard nut, on Halmahera it gets used when fresh, so not very hard.

Write you a mail!

Regards,
Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.