Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Keris Warung Kopi
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10th June 2015, 04:52 AM   #31
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Close up
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2015, 12:18 PM   #32
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Co teng blade

Better photo I hope
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2015, 01:30 PM   #33
Rick
Vikingsword Staff
 
Rick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,290
Smile

Much better .
Thanks !
Rick is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2015, 03:06 PM   #34
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Met a fellow collector of Coteng from Thailand..
Attached Images
   
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2015, 03:09 PM   #35
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Closer view
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2015, 03:12 PM   #36
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Coteng
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2015, 03:18 PM   #37
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Hope you like the photo showing different Coteng in different length
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2015, 03:20 PM   #38
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Different coteng

Showing Coteng
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2015, 04:44 AM   #39
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

I know many collectors here prefers to have strong blades and strong Keris.

Please bear with me. It seems that there are differences in the Coteng carvings as seen below. I was told that besides Wooden hilt, silver holt, there is also Coteng hilt made in Brass. Anyone seen Coteng hilt using other materials?
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2015, 04:53 AM   #40
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng Hilt

i have spoken with fellow Thai Keris collectors and they have confirmed that vintage Coteng comes mainly from Yala, Songkla or Narathiwat. However, I was told that one would not be able to see them so often in these cities now.

Another question that I have asked is with regards to why most Coteng is relatively shorter compare with the Longer Tajong and it seems is the result of the preferences from the region as those who prefer Coteng prefer it to be discreet. I have asked further why the conditions of the Coteng is not as well kept as the other Keris and the answer is that these Cotengs were used during their days and were not merely display Keris...

Just wanted to share what I have heard...
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2015, 05:20 AM   #41
BluErf
Member
 
BluErf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,180
Default

Good authentic cotengs! Glad you went to the right dealer and bought the right stuff. Well done!

The age of these kerises are very difficult to ascertain. They are probably pre-20th century, but even then, hard to be sure.

I have the idea that silver covered coteng are generally younger than the old plainer wooden ones. Tajongs and cotengs are related, and at some point shared a common ancestor. However, they evolved along their own paths and became distinct subforms. Hence, nit all cotengs are older than every tajong you see.

In terms of upper limits on age, the earliest coteng/tajong specimens found are probably around 2-300yrs old. So the proto-coteng probably came to the north Malay peninsula region around 16th-17th century. That's just theory though.
BluErf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2015, 11:42 AM   #42
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

The Tajong are also getting harder to find here in Thailand as many have restored new handles.

Have you travelled to Trengganu? Are there many antique Tajong or Coteng there?
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2015, 02:23 PM   #43
BluErf
Member
 
BluErf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,180
Default

Good ones are mostly in private collections. Mediocre ones for sale can still be found, but even then, they are getting harder to get and expensive.
BluErf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2015, 01:16 AM   #44
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng to share

Another Coteng to share..
Attached Images
  
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2015, 02:08 AM   #45
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng variations

There are many variations of Coteng. This example of Coteng has a sharper beak compare to the earlier..
Attached Images
    
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2015, 06:35 AM   #46
rasdan
Member
 
rasdan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Kuala Lumpur
Posts: 368
Default

Does anybody know the purpose of keris coteng?

Everyday weapon use, court use, wedding keris or pusaka?
rasdan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2015, 03:20 PM   #47
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

ı ʂ℘ơƙɛ ῳıɬɧ ą ʄɛῳ ƈơƖƖɛƈɬơཞs from Thailand, they have confirmed that these Coteng they found in the homes of the original owners were used by their ancestors...
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2015, 03:30 PM   #48
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng variations

This Coteng has a straight blade..For those who prefers a stronger blade..
Attached Images
 

Last edited by maxbliss888; 16th June 2015 at 03:45 PM.
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th June 2015, 02:20 PM   #49
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Blade

Day light photo
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2015, 07:55 AM   #50
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng with older wooden handle

Has any one seen this Coteng wooden handle? It looks like a Tajong but it's a Coteng
Attached Images
 

Last edited by maxbliss888; 18th June 2015 at 07:56 AM. Reason: Add details
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2015, 08:02 AM   #51
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxbliss888
Has any one seen this Coteng wooden handle? It looks like a Tajong but it's a Coteng
Very nice Coteng handle, maybe a transition piece.

Regards,
Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2015, 04:08 PM   #52
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng wooden

A fellow collector's Coteng
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2015, 07:51 PM   #53
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,254
Question

Hello Max,

Quote:
Has any one seen this Coteng wooden handle? It looks like a Tajong but it's a Coteng
To me this looks like a nice, probably early hulu Tajong: while really small, it does have a ridge below its chin which clearly represents a beard despite being smaller than usual (as compared with typical hulu Tajong).

AFAIK, hulu Coteng never have a beard and the typical flat head. The hilt you show has a considerably heavier head (again like typical hulu Tajong).

What is the reasoning of your local contacts? (Assuming they favor the classification of this hilt as hulu Coteng?)

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2015, 07:55 PM   #54
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,254
Default

Hello Max,

Thanks for posting all these keris Coteng (from your and other collections) for future reference!

Quote:
For those who prefers a stronger blade..
Some really neat examples, congrats!

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2015, 01:07 AM   #55
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Quote:
Originally Posted by kai
Hello Max,


To me this looks like a nice, probably early hulu Tajong: while really small, it does have a ridge below its chin which clearly represents a beard despite being smaller than usual (as compared with typical hulu Tajong).

AFAIK, hulu Coteng never have a beard and the typical flat head. The hilt you show has a considerably heavier head (again like typical hulu Tajong).

What is the reasoning of your local contacts? (Assuming they favor the classification of this hilt as hulu Coteng?)

Regards,
Kai
Thanks for your input.

The classification between Tajong and Coteng is often blurred here in this instance, which is why I thought it will be good to share with fellow collectors here. I have thought that since Thailand is the place for Tajong and Coteng, there will be opportunities to see more of these, but it Its not the case...

Hope you all enjoy the photos...

Last edited by maxbliss888; 19th June 2015 at 03:24 AM.
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2015, 03:26 AM   #56
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

A few Coteng to share...
Attached Images
 
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th June 2015, 04:43 AM   #57
BluErf
Member
 
BluErf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,180
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxbliss888
Has any one seen this Coteng wooden handle? It looks like a Tajong but it's a Coteng
This would normally be classified as a tajong. The form is closer to a mid-late period tajong.

It has a boxier form, and a rudimentary beard, from the looks of the photo.

A "kampung"" quality hilt, which is still nice, but not exactly an archetype form to do deep analysis on.
BluErf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th June 2015, 09:56 AM   #58
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

A friend's Coteng
Attached Images
   
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th June 2015, 09:58 AM   #59
maxbliss888
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 150
Default Coteng

Quote:
Originally Posted by BluErf
This would normally be classified as a tajong. The form is closer to a mid-late period tajong.

It has a boxier form, and a rudimentary beard, from the looks of the photo.

A "kampung"" quality hilt, which is still nice, but not exactly an archetype form to do deep analysis on.
Thanks..

First time I heard the term Kampung quality hilt... : ı thought all Keris are made in some kampong somewhere during the ancient days...

Last edited by maxbliss888; 28th June 2015 at 01:10 PM.
maxbliss888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th June 2015, 03:47 PM   #60
BluErf
Member
 
BluErf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,180
Default

I meant good enough to wear around in the kampung, but not fine enough for the higher social strata. Sorry, this sounds politically incorrect, but that's the way art is. The centre of wealth and political power breeds high excellence in artistic expression which form the pinnacles of art that ordinary folks copy, emulate and aspire to own/consume. Like all facsimiles, definition is lost in the process.
Attached Images
 
BluErf is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.