Unknown Short Sword Or Big Knife

[Robert]

A few more pictures. I hope these help.

[trenchwarfare]

I sold a very similar knife on ebay a while back. Is this it? Frog looks different. If same, was an ebay purchase. Seller said it was carried by an Italian officer, in Ethiopia, pre WWI?

[Robert]

Trenchwarfare, Thank you for responding to this post and for the information. To be honest I really can't remember exactly how long that I have had this knife but I believe that I bought it about 2 years (or maybe a little longer) ago on ebay. The frog is the one that came with it when I bought it. Was the grip on the one that you had made of water buffalo horn? Thanks again.


Robert

[trenchwarfare]

Robert. I'm pretty sure this is the same knife. Sold it a couple of years ago. I've sold hundreds of knives on ebay, but remember everyone. Many were, and are hard to part with. I have a limited budget, so can't keep 'em all. Got to stay focused. But, when you love cold steel, it's hard to do. Looks like you repaired the scabbard, near the tip? The one I had was broken there. Can't tell in the pictures, but the knife I had was discolored at the point, from being in a fire. Yes, it had a Horn handle. The reason I wanted to believe the Italian connection, was the European style frog, and the "Romanesque" brass handle spacer. Seems that the frog was more tan colored? Whatever it is, it's a very nice piece. Good luck with a positive ID. M.P.

[Robert]

Yes I did repair the scabbard tip after it arrived to keep it from breaking off completely. The difference in color on the frog is due to the mink oil that I use to help preserve the leather on the scabbards of all the items that I have. The discoloration on the tip of the blade came disappeared when I cleaned off the small amount of rust that was starting to accumulate there. I know how you feel, I find it very hard to let go of any of my edged friends. Thank you again for your interest and help on this.

Robert

[Gonzalo G]

Robert, in my opinion this is an argenitienan facón, but I need to say that there are some unusual features related with this piece. The blade seems older than the hilt, which was a common constructive feature in the facones, as they were usually made with recycled blades. The general form of the hilt and the work there also seems to be argentinean. Is it not related to the mexican weapons at all, and I don´t believe it could be phillipine. The horn probably is black horn from argentinean cattle. The ring separating the two portions of horn could be chased or repousee, a common practice on argentinean metal work, and the acanthus leaves are also a comon decorative motifs in this country. The form of the pommel and the construction of the rivet also fits in the argentinean style.

Neverthless, the blade is not the most common to find on the facones, but not excluded form their style, as thet have single edged blades with or withoul a false edge, not necesarily form a bayonet. It could be made from the point of a broken sword The guard and the scabard are more strange, as cooper was not recommended among argentineans to make this pieces. It could be a latter fit, though a particular facón maker could decide to use this material not having another one at hand. The form of the guard is found in the classic facones, but it could be also a copy. The scabbar does resemble a military one, and there is a possibility it is not the original one fo this blade, but from a blade with a symetric spear point, but I can´t be sure form the pictures. What most calls my attention, is the fact that the facon was not used on a scabbard suspended form the belt, but crossed under it on the back side. So, the scabbard loop seems strange and out of place, and this makes me feel that, or the scabbard was added latter and keeped as it came, or that this weapon can be used by another type of person different from the criollo cowboy, or even that the knife could have another origin, though it fit in the facón type without problem.

Also, brass fitting are not as common as silver ones, but it can be a solution for a working facón made for a modest person with some income. The silver mounted facones are the top of the line, but do not reflect the general production of this weapons, only a portion of it. It´s difficul to establish the age of this piece, as the hilt style is very classic and it can be made form the 19th Century and forward, but I´have the feeling that it could be made after or around 1900´s, or maybe earlier. Sadly, we find more usually silver mounted facones than from the other kind of mounts, because the silver mounted were considered more worthy to be photographed, more valuable in terms of money, more attractive and, yes, more flashy. But in historic and museographic terms, I think the more modest facones are most representative of their kind and of their intended use in the daily life of the criollo cowboy. The silver mounted ones are more ceremonial items and a symbol of status among landowners to this date.

A very interesting piece. You should wiritte to Abel Domenech and conffirm the origin of this piece, and from the other "could be" argentinean pieces you have.

Domenech, Abel

dagasdeplata@yahoo.com

He´s a very open and kind person. I don´t think he´s is going to be bothered by your petition. On the contrary, maybe he could find very interesting your pieces, as he collects them.
Regards

Gonzalo

[Rick]

For what it's worth ; the blade profile reminds me a bit of a Chinese Bowie .