Panabas, aka Bruticus Maximus...

Spunjer · 25th March 2005, 04:08 AM

thanks for everyone's response!

Federico, would you care to elaborate more about the panabas? to me, it's really a very enigmatic weapon/tool(?). the only thing i know about it is what i read on cato's book.

Rick, i always thought the first picture's pretty cool. as you scan thru the moros from right to left, they look like some mean SOB's that you just don't wanna mess with; that is until you get to the very last person on the left. now why did he have to pose like that?

btw, the panabas on the right looks weird. instead of the tip being flat, it's angled; seems like you can use it for thrusting. nice specimen. anyone here own something similar to that?

the bottom pic is news to me. it's kinda cool in a macabre way...

Federico · 25th March 2005, 06:26 AM

Mmmm...silver hilted Panabas, I bet there is an awesome blade underneath that scabbard. One thing to note about that picture, seated in the middle is Datu Uto, rightfully the last sultan of Buayan/Maguindanao. He was immensely powerful, as well as wealthy. In the majority of Mindanao period pics, of various datus posing with their followers, that I have seen, I have seldom seen pics of scabbards laden in precious metals. Which highlights the rarity of such pieces as being only affordable/suitable to someone such as Datu Uto, who held off Spanish control of Mindanao effectively till they were forced to leave, despite their modern weaponry. Which is also why I am very very skeptical of many, if not most lavish metal hilted/scabbarded kris that pour out of PI. Beyond the mere limits of those of wealth at the time who could afford such lavishness, were the limits of those who were of the right status to even contemplate bearing such a kris. Ok I sidetracked.

Spunjer, afraid I dont have much to add. My experience with Panabas is very limited, as well as my knowledge of them. Ive heard stories similar to the ones in Cato's book (again even Bob would admit there are errors in there), Panabas that need to be fed regularly on blood or they will seek their own meal, Panabas being held in sacred spots in the homes of royalty as valued pusaka, etc... Also stories of Panabas bearers taking the rear of the line, to "finish up" those who werent quite finished by the first wave of fighters. Nothing too unique, and well alot of it is second hand (eg. I was told this). While I trust the people who told me, I cannot say that someone else may not have more accurate information. Ive also noted, in similar period Mindnanao court pics such as the one Rick posted, you can usually spot one being borne by a warrior, highlighting its role as symbol of State Power. Anyways, if one looks at alot of the more modern ag-based panabas that pop up on ebay, one can easily see a big difference in style/look. One can also see the connection between the evolution of the Panabas. However, its kinda like the garab/talibong. While there is a superficial resemblence to a more modern ag tool, its history as a fighting only weapon is beyond mere looks. Anyways, I suppose this isnt too helpful, but hopefully someone who knows more about Panabas can shed further light.

Conogre · 25th March 2005, 08:01 AM

Thanks for clarifying on the non-duality of the panabas, Federico, with what you stated being what I've suspected since I personally held one, as they are simply too heavy to be used in harvesting rice, no matter what the blade is shaped like.
In some instances, the weight of a particular bladed piece would seem to have immense bearing on its use as a weapon in spite of what is thought to be used for, often based upon what it's shape resembles.
If too heavy to be used in harvesting a food crop, such as rice, and with a hilt that wouldn't stand up if used in lieu of an axe, not much is left for a purpose besides a weapon if one uses common sense and the process of elimination.
Mike

Bill · 25th March 2005, 08:10 PM

an interesting thing is one can easily look up PI court documents about criminal trials, on the internet. There is a number of murder trials (receint)that the panabas is the weapon, often being described as a agricultural tool. Little doubt the "Moro" panabas was strickly used as a weapon, but likely there was also a tool that at times was used as a weapon, then, as now.

Conogre · 25th March 2005, 10:21 PM

A very good point, Bill.
Does anyone know of a non-Moro tool or impliment that resembles a panabas from the PI, or even a Moro equivelent used JUST for agriculture?
Mike

Ian · 26th March 2005, 05:14 AM

Mike:

We had one on this old thread http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002044.html but unfortunately the pictures are gone now. I'll see if I still have them.

Ian.

Bill · 26th March 2005, 02:44 PM

From what I have read, the early "Moro" seldom used thier valuable iron for tools. But they were early ship builders, & a panabas would likely be valuable in the process. Anyone have info on "Moro" ship building. Seen quite a few referance to ship building in Mindanao but little attributed to early Sulu Archipelago. What early tools were needed?

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25th March 2005, 04:08 AM	#1
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	thanks for everyone's response! Federico, would you care to elaborate more about the panabas? to me, it's really a very enigmatic weapon/tool(?). the only thing i know about it is what i read on cato's book. Rick, i always thought the first picture's pretty cool. as you scan thru the moros from right to left, they look like some mean SOB's that you just don't wanna mess with; that is until you get to the very last person on the left. now why did he have to pose like that? btw, the panabas on the right looks weird. instead of the tip being flat, it's angled; seems like you can use it for thrusting. nice specimen. anyone here own something similar to that? the bottom pic is news to me. it's kinda cool in a macabre way...

25th March 2005, 06:26 AM	#2
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Mmmm...silver hilted Panabas, I bet there is an awesome blade underneath that scabbard. One thing to note about that picture, seated in the middle is Datu Uto, rightfully the last sultan of Buayan/Maguindanao. He was immensely powerful, as well as wealthy. In the majority of Mindanao period pics, of various datus posing with their followers, that I have seen, I have seldom seen pics of scabbards laden in precious metals. Which highlights the rarity of such pieces as being only affordable/suitable to someone such as Datu Uto, who held off Spanish control of Mindanao effectively till they were forced to leave, despite their modern weaponry. Which is also why I am very very skeptical of many, if not most lavish metal hilted/scabbarded kris that pour out of PI. Beyond the mere limits of those of wealth at the time who could afford such lavishness, were the limits of those who were of the right status to even contemplate bearing such a kris. Ok I sidetracked. Spunjer, afraid I dont have much to add. My experience with Panabas is very limited, as well as my knowledge of them. Ive heard stories similar to the ones in Cato's book (again even Bob would admit there are errors in there), Panabas that need to be fed regularly on blood or they will seek their own meal, Panabas being held in sacred spots in the homes of royalty as valued pusaka, etc... Also stories of Panabas bearers taking the rear of the line, to "finish up" those who werent quite finished by the first wave of fighters. Nothing too unique, and well alot of it is second hand (eg. I was told this). While I trust the people who told me, I cannot say that someone else may not have more accurate information. Ive also noted, in similar period Mindnanao court pics such as the one Rick posted, you can usually spot one being borne by a warrior, highlighting its role as symbol of State Power. Anyways, if one looks at alot of the more modern ag-based panabas that pop up on ebay, one can easily see a big difference in style/look. One can also see the connection between the evolution of the Panabas. However, its kinda like the garab/talibong. While there is a superficial resemblence to a more modern ag tool, its history as a fighting only weapon is beyond mere looks. Anyways, I suppose this isnt too helpful, but hopefully someone who knows more about Panabas can shed further light.

25th March 2005, 08:01 AM	#3
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	Thanks for clarifying on the non-duality of the panabas, Federico, with what you stated being what I've suspected since I personally held one, as they are simply too heavy to be used in harvesting rice, no matter what the blade is shaped like. In some instances, the weight of a particular bladed piece would seem to have immense bearing on its use as a weapon in spite of what is thought to be used for, often based upon what it's shape resembles. If too heavy to be used in harvesting a food crop, such as rice, and with a hilt that wouldn't stand up if used in lieu of an axe, not much is left for a purpose besides a weapon if one uses common sense and the process of elimination. Mike

25th March 2005, 08:10 PM	#4
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	an interesting thing is one can easily look up PI court documents about criminal trials, on the internet. There is a number of murder trials (receint)that the panabas is the weapon, often being described as a agricultural tool. Little doubt the "Moro" panabas was strickly used as a weapon, but likely there was also a tool that at times was used as a weapon, then, as now.

25th March 2005, 10:21 PM	#5
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	A very good point, Bill. Does anyone know of a non-Moro tool or impliment that resembles a panabas from the PI, or even a Moro equivelent used JUST for agriculture? Mike

26th March 2005, 05:14 AM	#6
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,717	Mike: We had one on this old thread http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002044.html but unfortunately the pictures are gone now. I'll see if I still have them. Ian.

26th March 2005, 02:44 PM	#7
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	From what I have read, the early "Moro" seldom used thier valuable iron for tools. But they were early ship builders, & a panabas would likely be valuable in the process. Anyone have info on "Moro" ship building. Seen quite a few referance to ship building in Mindanao but little attributed to early Sulu Archipelago. What early tools were needed?