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#1 | |
Keris forum moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
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#2 |
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 9,165
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Another one, simple and in wood: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=kris
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#3 |
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Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Sanibel Florida
Posts: 104
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I don’t know that I’d call this a fixation but rather a hypothesis. We have a Kris form that significantly deviates from all other Moro forms. I am suggesting that one possible reason for the divergence is that the form is dislocated from the traditions which bind other Kris making groups within the region. My working hypothesis is that the makers of this form are not the traditional Islamic Moro smiths with which we are accustomed. The pattern of the hilt form is significant and distinct from the other forms to a degree to which conjecture as to origin, symbolism and form change are IMHO questions we should be open to exploring.
As for the bird form… I would ask you to look again at the two archaic hilts I last posted and look first for the similarities, which I find to be very compelling. Once those are identified then questioning the dissimilarity and the possible reasons for them could help us determine different directions for discussion as to origin, etc. It is for this reason I’ve asked forum member to assist in locating any other reference pieces for this discussion. Theories on other symbolic forms that could be the genesis for these deviations are definitely open for discussion and ideas in that vain will be appreciated. I would however point to the fact that the Garuda figure as far as cultural timetable relevance throughout SEA is very significant and all kris forms likely have some influence from exposure to these earliest of documented empires that encompassed these areas. However, Buddhist, Islam and then Christian empires definitely overlaid this same region. Also given that what I will refer to as “Native” mythology certainly existed and was likely significantly influenced by each of these successive empires over time. My question as a starting point for this discuss is to dive into the possible answers, not to prove the one I think potentially viable. With that said here is another pic I found in the forum that is interesting. I believe Ron may have owned this kris. |
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#4 |
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Join Date: Oct 2018
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Hi, my kris also has an indomalay hilt which Rafngard referred to as Jawa Demam. Like you, I'm also trying to research its history in the Bangsamoro timeline. I like how it fits in my hand.
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#5 |
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Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Sanibel Florida
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What a fabulous Kris! So far my research is pointing toward the Northern Coast of Borneo and I am still skeptical as to the Jawa Demam origin for this Kris style. The Hindu and Buddhist influences among the peoples of this area are well documented and date back to the 4th century. My working hypothesis is that the symbolisms and form that date back to these earlier societal beliefs stayed as a part of the culture and mythology and are the bases for the form we see in these more rare Kris. With that said the mythological, Sarimanok is definitely another potential source for this form, but given the area I am finding as the origin for these Kris I am not seeing that as likely. I think discussion on these points iare important. hopefully it leads us closer to understanding the group of smiths from which these blades come.
As a side note it appears there was significant trade in kris blades of high quality between Moro and Malay peoples and that Moro Kris blades became status symbols throughout the sultanate. |
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#6 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2018
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I'm not well-versed in Mindanao and Sulu art, but I can see traces of Moro patterns in our odd hilts. Also, to note- I read that jawa demam has a certain ambiguity when it comes to what's depicted on the pommel- sometimes it's indeed viewed of as garuda; but it can also be viewed as a crouched man carrying a snake. This is interestingly parallel to the prevailing symbols in Mindanao and Sulu- Mindanao, for its sarimanok, and Sulu, for its naga. |
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#7 | |
Keris forum moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
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