Meteorite again

[David]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

That's cruel David, purely cruel.

This can be downloaded if you are able to push the right buttons:-


"The Magical Life of Things" --- Margaret J. Wiener


It is a nice little addition to furthering an understanding of the keris, nothing new, not an expose of hidden knowledge, just a simple, commonsense commentary.

Pauzan Pusposukadgo used to believe that much of the "mystical/magical" belief surrounding the keris was due to the involvement of the Dutch. I personally think that Dutch influence was only one factor.

The people of Jawa & Bali do understand the world in a way that differs from the way in which people from European based societies understand the world, particularly post-industrial European based cultures.

Not only is understanding different, but the societal system of behaviour is different. Javanese people will normally try to provide an answer to a question that they sense the questioner expects, not necessarily an accurate answer, but one that will please the questioner.

The keris in some circumstance could be considered to be a "magically charged" object, but that "magic" cannot be understood unless one understands the Javanese mode of thought and World View.

Cruel Alan? Really? Honestly i feel you have done me a bit of an injustice here, but perhaps it is my own fault for not being clear enough.
Firstly, my comment had absolutely nothing to do with Javanese (or even general Indonesian) culture, the mystical/magical beliefs surrounding meteoric pamor or whether or not a keris can be a "magically charged" object. While it is true that i mention rupiah you may have noted that i also mention dollars and cents. Perhaps i should have been more of a completist and brought lira, pounds, euro and dinars into the equation. My remark was not intended as an indictment of the Javanese way of things. Rather it was a comment on the Culture of Salesmanship. This culture is universal. It has no national origin. Yes, i am well aware of the Javanese penchant of politeness in their tendency to tell others what they believe the questioner might like to hear, mostly because it is a trait which you have repeatedly posted about on this forum many times. I tend to pay rather close attention to the things you have to say on this forum as well as our private conversations. But while this may be a trait of Javanese culture with the root intention towards polite behavior it is also a main tenet of the culture of the salesman with the intent being to deceive and increase sales potential. It may be that you are too deeply involved in the Javanese keris world to see the pervasiveness of sales techniques from keris sellers around the world. For instance, i realize that you don't spend too much time scanning the keris pages of eBay or other online auction sites. But the use of the lure of meteoric pamor as a means to gain higher prices for keris sold by sellers all around the world is a quite common technique. It is part of the reason that misunderstandings about the legendary meteoric pamor are so hard to kill in the keris marketplace. It isn't being brought up as a polite response to a question where one feels the need to tell the questioner what would most please them. It is being pushed as a selling point. I am not being cruel, i am being straightforward and truthful.
And if anyone would like to read Margret Wiener's "The Magic Life of Things" it can be downloaded here:
https://www.academia.edu/2060088/The...Life_of_Things
As has been probably mentioned numerous times on these pages, i would also recommend her book "Visible and Invisible Realms. Power, Magic, and Colonial Conquest in Bali".