Chivalry

micas · 23rd April 2006, 02:31 AM

Didn't know I was being vehement but I'm guessing it might be construed that way.

The point I was making is that "real" bravery would be someone making a decision to risk their lives, personal security without being forced into it and without an audience to shame them into bravery or the promise of fame.

Just recently I watched a documentary by Werner Herzog titled "Grizzly Man". It was about some guy who wanted to be "one with the grizzlies" and in the end was eaten by them along with his girlfriend (who feared the bears). The last moments were captured on audio and it shows how the girlfriend, despite her obvious fear, tried to drive the bear away from her boyfriend who had been mauled. The boyfriend was pleading for her to run away but she tried to save him and subsequently killed as well in an isolated part of Alaska.

These acts of personal bravery are worth more than the courage of following orders to attack a fortified position. I value that woman more for her decency as a human being.

Rick · 23rd April 2006, 03:04 AM

Micas , in my opinion they were both idiots . Grizzlies are not sentient beings ; if you're smaller than them then you are potentially a meal ; it's just that simple in my view . I commend the man's female friend for trying to save him ; still to put oneself in the position of being a snack for a large bear shows an extreme lack of common sense .

One of my ancestors showed up for the battle of Bunker (Breed's) Hill ; he was a teenaged boy and manned the trenches with his older neighbors trying to repel the British troops threatening Boston . Young Eleazor French lost his arm to a cannonball during that battle ; he carried the severed limb back to his home in Dunstable after the fight because he was damned if he would leave anything for the redcoats to gloat over .
Was he a hero or a damnfool kid ?
I really don't know ; maybe he showed up to defend his country or maybe just for the thrill of the fight ; either way he showed up and became a part of history .

micas · 23rd April 2006, 03:33 AM

What the woman did was brave regardless of their idiot action being there in the first place which was not the point I was making. If you want to go there we can go into the whole idiocy of war. But I've had that conversation before and it's something I'd prefer to avoid along with talks about politics and religion

Rick · 23rd April 2006, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by micas

What the woman did was brave regardless of their idiot action being there in the first place which was not the point I was making. If you want to go there we can go into the whole idiocy of war. But I've had that conversation before and it's something I'd prefer to avoid along with talks about politics and religion

That's fine Micas , but I'm afraid like it or not war is an essential part of the human condition ; now we can pretend that the elephant is not standing in the middle of the living room but in reality it is .

Yes , the woman was brave and devoted to her partner .
I praise her for that .

MABAGANI · 23rd April 2006, 04:30 AM

Besides bravery when i hear the word "chivalry" as it relates to knighthood, the aspects i think of are gallantry towards women and courtly love...

A good book i'm reading again is called "With the Bravest", untold history about the Sulu guerilla forces during WWII, outnumbered and outgunned they effectively held their ground with guns, kris and barung...one of their unknown claims to fame was spotting the enemy fleet and relaying the info to command, changing the outcome of the naval campaigns...

Rivkin · 23rd April 2006, 06:04 AM

a

nechesh · 24th April 2006, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

That's fine Micas , but I'm afraid like it or not war is an essential part of the human condition ; now we can pretend that the elephant is not standing in the middle of the living room but in reality it is .

Somehow i don't think this is really what you meant to say Rick. Unavoidable...perhaps, but there is nothing about war or humanity that makes it an "essential" part of the human condition. If this were truly the case i would just as soon leave this plane of existence for more hopeful territory.

Interestingly, the bravery and valour (i just love the English spelling

) displayed by Frodo and Sam in The Lord of the Rings is not based upon their taking of others lives in battle, but upon their willingness to give up their own lives so that others can live and succede. This is the essence of true heroism for me, not how many men a single man can kill in any given battle.

Rick · 24th April 2006, 07:54 PM

You have a point David .
Unavoidable fits my meaning much better .

Unfortunately though my friend I'm going to insist you proofread all of my future posts .......

nechesh · 24th April 2006, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

You have a point David .
Unavoidable fits my meaning much better .

Unfortunately though my friend I'm going to insist you proofread all of my future posts .......

AAAAARRRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!

23rd April 2006, 06:04 AM	#6
Rivkin Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 655	a Last edited by Rivkin; 23rd April 2006 at 04:32 PM.

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23rd April 2006, 02:31 AM	#1
micas Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 30	Didn't know I was being vehement but I'm guessing it might be construed that way. The point I was making is that "real" bravery would be someone making a decision to risk their lives, personal security without being forced into it and without an audience to shame them into bravery or the promise of fame. Just recently I watched a documentary by Werner Herzog titled "Grizzly Man". It was about some guy who wanted to be "one with the grizzlies" and in the end was eaten by them along with his girlfriend (who feared the bears). The last moments were captured on audio and it shows how the girlfriend, despite her obvious fear, tried to drive the bear away from her boyfriend who had been mauled. The boyfriend was pleading for her to run away but she tried to save him and subsequently killed as well in an isolated part of Alaska. These acts of personal bravery are worth more than the courage of following orders to attack a fortified position. I value that woman more for her decency as a human being.

23rd April 2006, 03:04 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	Micas , in my opinion they were both idiots . Grizzlies are not sentient beings ; if you're smaller than them then you are potentially a meal ; it's just that simple in my view . I commend the man's female friend for trying to save him ; still to put oneself in the position of being a snack for a large bear shows an extreme lack of common sense . One of my ancestors showed up for the battle of Bunker (Breed's) Hill ; he was a teenaged boy and manned the trenches with his older neighbors trying to repel the British troops threatening Boston . Young Eleazor French lost his arm to a cannonball during that battle ; he carried the severed limb back to his home in Dunstable after the fight because he was damned if he would leave anything for the redcoats to gloat over . Was he a hero or a damnfool kid ? I really don't know ; maybe he showed up to defend his country or maybe just for the thrill of the fight ; either way he showed up and became a part of history .

23rd April 2006, 03:33 AM	#3
micas Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 30	What the woman did was brave regardless of their idiot action being there in the first place which was not the point I was making. If you want to go there we can go into the whole idiocy of war. But I've had that conversation before and it's something I'd prefer to avoid along with talks about politics and religion

23rd April 2006, 04:30 AM	#5
MABAGANI Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 221	Besides bravery when i hear the word "chivalry" as it relates to knighthood, the aspects i think of are gallantry towards women and courtly love... A good book i'm reading again is called "With the Bravest", untold history about the Sulu guerilla forces during WWII, outnumbered and outgunned they effectively held their ground with guns, kris and barung...one of their unknown claims to fame was spotting the enemy fleet and relaying the info to command, changing the outcome of the naval campaigns...

24th April 2006, 07:54 PM	#8
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	You have a point David . Unavoidable fits my meaning much better . Unfortunately though my friend I'm going to insist you proofread all of my future posts .......