Shotley Bridge swordmakers

[urbanspaceman]

Would smiths weld short hunting sword blades to new tangs to benefit from a high quality blade on a cutlass?
I've been told it was a question of making the high grade metal go further as it was not needed up at that end of the sword; any comments?

Surely all that is needed to establish the materials involved is a few file shavings from the edge of the blade; the back being the most acceptable. Any metallurgists out there want samples from my blade - just ask and I'll happily file off a few grains.

I understood that Samuel Harvey used an H as well as SH.
I think there was a WH too: as yet unattributed I believe.

I've tracked down and contacted the current owner of Danby Castle (it's the same family since Edward the Confessor) who has indicated the present whereabouts of the chest of SB swords discovered in a Priest Hole back in 1855 and said to have been destined for the Jacobite cause. I'm on my way to view them soon and salivating.

Thank-you CC, those marks and names are very useful; but - sorry: who is Joseph Witten?
My hanger is marked with a crown over a 9, but I suspect it was put on the blade when it was re-hilted, as the steel in the base of the stamp is brighter than the rest of the blade. Of course, it's stamped onto the hilt end of the scarf weld so... ???

Any military historians out there know where and when 2nd Battalions appeared in the ranks of British Militia? My hilt is marked S d B.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams Kieth, Indeed there is a further puzzle inside this conundrum with the appearance of a W HARVEY ..Below. No Fox there however. Was this a miss strike? Was it done at the same time because Harvey also appeared on its own but with no initial see below...in several formats. ? I will try to address that in my next post...

The point about the H is that it is said to be a Hounslow mark. The confusion is underlined by it appearing inside an animal which looks more like a Labrador than a Fox... I have only seen one of these. Harvey senior had a son also named Samuel... and Samuel Jr had a son. Both were in Swords but I cannot find the grandsons name...was it also Samuel?

Below are various Harvey blade strikes...plus some randomly applied Passau Wolf and one from Solingen.There is an apparent Shotley sword with a Passau Wolf...There is an H inside a fox? There's an empty Fox. There is an altered SH made to look like SB...for whatever reason and the odd W HARVEY.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

The only W Harvey I can find is as follows below
however some doubts were cast upon it because of its apparent date of manufacture about 1840...however the firm had been operational since 1820 ! I believe therefor putting this mark W HARVEY in range.

However... things never being so simple ...especially on this subject please see http://americansocietyofarmscollecto...2_Darling1.pdf

Where there is a sword with the stamp W HARVEY ...used 60 years before W Harvey came to be as a sword maker ...with his mark on the blade... very odd. However are we looking at a rehilted later blade ?

[urbanspaceman]

Has anyone ever come across a Hounslow blade with a Fox or Wolf mark?
It seems odd that Solingen smiths in Hounslow didn't use the Passau wolf-mark but, allegedly, Shotley Bridge did.
I think this issue is beginning to point to the blades with the wolf as being smuggled in, then stamped Shotle Bridg to deflect away suspicion from the crime.
There's a lot of time and effort involved in applying all these marks.
I'm hoping my inspection of bulk collections of Shotley Bridge battlefield swords in the very near future will help to establish some acceptable facts.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

Has anyone ever come across a Hounslow blade with a Fox or Wolf mark?
It seems odd that Solingen smiths in Hounslow didn't use the Passau wolf-mark but, allegedly, Shotley Bridge did.
I think this issue is beginning to point to the blades with the wolf as being smuggled in, then stamped Shotle Bridg to deflect away suspicion from the crime.
There's a lot of time and effort involved in applying all these marks.
I'm hoping my inspection of bulk collections of Shotley Bridge battlefield swords in the very near future will help to establish some acceptable facts.

Salaams Kieth ~ It will be interesting to see this group of blades you speak of... The only fox I saw said to be Hounslow ...and with an H in it... is above at #206 last photo, though it is a picture repeated many times around the web...but its the only one I have ever seen.

[urbanspaceman]

Hello Ibrahiim. Does the sword with that alleged Hounslow mark tally with the date of Hounslow production? Somewhere down the line (in my case a very short line) I read an emphatic declaration that Hounslow never used such a mark. I thought that "Me Fecit", or something of the sort, was used when wishing to identify a Hounslow worker. I still keep coming back to this 'time and effort' issue of marking swords: if you are paid to produce as many blades as possible in as short a time as possible, for battlefield weapons, then I would have thought a single, simple tang stamp, or such, was the best you would consider. If you were producing something for a London cutler to retail then the prestige of the workmanship warranted the work involved in sophisticated emblems.
I will know more when I've surveyed the armouries of some of our castles up here. We have a lot! This was not a comfortable place to retire-to for most of its history. I grew up on a 1930s built street that had, until 1932, a castle at both ends, with a provenance dating back to pre. Norman times in one case, and Norman in another (that one is still in existence) . Dig down anywhere round there and you would probably find a Viking sword eventually. But I digress...

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Not quite since Me Fecit or made in...was used in Solingen as well... and in Hounslow..See


https://stmargarets.london/archives/...ow_swords.html

However, you will see the same animal with an H in it on the above site... It appears repeated all over the web but I have never seen another.

Other Me Fecit examples ~ 'PETER BRABENDER ME FECIT IN SOLINGEN'

"CLEMENS HORN ME FECIT SOLINGEN.

“JOSEPH JENCKES ME FECIT HOUNSLO.

An English Basket shown below is from Hounslow with ME FECIT HOUNSLO on the blade.