semi-dual edged badik?

[Moshah]

Originally Posted by kai

I believe your blade was made from wesi/besi malela (a heavily forged steel with often higher carbon content which yields the dark, even stain despite being laminated).

Your badik could well be from northern Malaya (not sure though).

Regards,
Kai

Hi Kai,

if the blade was made with such besi with higher carbon contain, does it mean it can easily break? I've read somewhere stated that besi melela was actually comes from a sandy grains along the west coast of java. Is that true?

if not laminated, means that it was not done like how a keris should be?

Thanks for the input, kai. Really appreciate it...

[kai]

Hello Moshah,

if the blade was made with such besi with higher carbon contain, does it mean it can easily break?

I wouldn't worry (unless one tries to abuse it as a sharpened pry bar); competent differential hardening can go a long way. If used incorrectly, the weak point (for most of the personal sidearms throughout the archipelago) would most likely be the hilt IMVHO.

I've read somewhere stated that besi melela was actually comes from a sandy grains along the west coast of java. Is that true?

I'm sure there were a lot of local sources; secondary iron deposits are not rare in wet climates.

if not laminated, means that it was not done like how a keris should be?

These are laminated (on a microscopic level) and traditional. There may be some blades made from imported European steel hiding within the wesi/besi malela category but usually you will see some forging lines suggesting extensive local forge work regardless of the primary source.

Regards,
Kai

[Moshah]

Thanks for the elaborated explanation Kai...

Hmm I'm really critical on this one as most badik I've seen were pamorred, at least slight pamor. This one was plain baja, but somehow the mid part looks like it was fullered, which is something i've never seen on a badik.

But then my biggest worry would be another kind of dagger / edged weapon "impersonated" to look like a badik...

[CharlesS]

In Sajen's example, does anyone else see the possibility of a cut down pedang blade finding, perhaps, a second life as a badik?

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by CharlesS

In Sajen's example, does anyone else see the possibility of a cut down pedang blade finding, perhaps, a second life as a badik?

It's maybe possible but I don't think so. Soon as I have better light I will post some pictures from the blade.

[Moshah]

I think it is quite unlikely Detlef's was a cut down pedang, as the fuller length would not make any sense, to be that short a fuller for a longer blade.

Definitely there were traces of pamor as well, on detlef's badik.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Moshah

I think it is quite unlikely Detlef's was a cut down pedang, as the fuller length would not make any sense, to be that short a fuller for a longer blade.

Definitely there were traces of pamor as well, on detlef's badik.

Agree with you Moshah regarding the fuller.

The blade have a very fine pamor, unfortunately it's very dark etched so it's difficult to see.

[kai]

Hello Moshah,

I'm really critical on this one as most badik I've seen were pamorred, at least slight pamor. This one was plain baja, but somehow the mid part looks like it was fullered, which is something i've never seen on a badik.

But then my biggest worry would be another kind of dagger / edged weapon "impersonated" to look like a badik...

Don't worry - this seems to be a rare and genuine variant: I have another one and with at least 3 extant examples this makes a pattern (rather than a headache ). If the N Malay attribution can be confirmed, this might be a local style. As already suggested, it clearly shows heavy Bugis influence. However, the blade is always broad, flat with a wide and shallow central fuller, has a partial edge at the back of the blade, and is made from besi malela. The blade has enough strength for stabbing as well as cutting and is very quick/agile due to its low weight. I believe the stronger material makes this configuration feasible. It's well possible that the looks of European sabres influenced the blade profile; however, all 3 pieces seem to be locally crafted on purpose, not recycled from broken swords.

The typical Bugis badik from Sulawesi tends to have either a relatively narrow blade optimized for stabbing or a blade with fat belly adding more meat towards the tip for slashing moves. Both types tend to have a fairly thick back of the blade (as usual for most SE Asian daggers). I have seen several with partial back edge like in Detlef's example though. Some appear to be recycled pedang/etc. blades but quite a few are obviously intentional designs like already pointed out for Detlef's badik.

Moshah, could you please post a pic of its scabbard? I'll try to come up with pics of mine, too.

Regards,
Kai