Chinese Bronze Age dagger

[bluelake]

I have one almost exactly like it (not pictured). I got it back in the 90s here in Korea; it was brought in from China. Mine's a fake, but interesting. Actually, I used to pick up imitation Chinese bronzes, as some of them are very well-made and look nice, even if not original. Attached is one of my favorites; I often use it in my Korean history classes so students can feel the weight of a bronze sword. Many years ago, I used to have a reproduction "bipa" (an ancient musical instrument) shaped bronze sword, which was used in NE Asia, but someone else wanted it a lot more...

Other common bronze fakes are arrow points and bronze mirrors. Fortunately, I came upon a cache of original bronze arrow points before faking became popular. There used to be some fantastic original bronzes available here in Korea, but not anymore. As an antiquities expert and friend of mine once said regarding Chinese bronzes, "It was probably made in a certain Beijing alley last Tuesday".

[VANDOO]

THE LAST PICTURE POSTED IN THIS THREAD APPEARS TO BE A GOOD BRONZE REPLICA CHINESE SWORD I HAVE SEEN MANY SUCH ITEMS AND THE ONES I HAVE HAD FOR MANY YEARS HAVE NEVER DEFORMED OR CRACKED.
HERE ARE PICTURES OF THE GREEK LETTEROPENER (SORRY FOR THE POOR QUALITY PICTURES I TRIED SEVERAL TIMES BUT THESE WERE THE BEST I COULD DO AND I DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO LIGHTEN OR INHANCE CONTRAST). THIS GREEK ITEM IS MADE OF A POOR TYPE OF POT METAL AND WILL NOT DRAW A MAGNET THE PATINA HAS BEEN APPLIED TO THE OUTSIDE THE INSIDE RESEMBLES YOUR ITEM IN COLOR. NOTE THE BLADE HAS BENT AND IS BRITTLE THE TIP BROKE OFF SO IT CAN'T BE STRAIGHTENED. THERE ARE CRACKS THRU OUT AND IT CONTINUES TO DEGRADE.
A PICTURE OF A TYPICAL CHINESE SHOP OF WHICH THERE ARE CERTIANLY THOUSANDS IN CHINA JUST ONE OF MANY SHELFS IN THE SHOP.
A PICTURE OF A LURISTAN SWORD 20.75INCH LONG. NOTE THE HANDLE IT HAS A RAISED BRONZE FORM TO HOLD A INSERT OF HORN, WOOD OR STONE AS IS USUAL FOR MOUNTING INSERTS. YOUR EXAMPLE APPEARS TO HAVE HAD THE STONE PRESSED IN WHILE THE METAL WAS STILL SOFT.
I LIKE THE OLD SOLID BRONZE CHINESE REPLICAS BUT DO NOT LIKE THE POTMETAL SOUVINEER FOR OBVIOUS REASONS. I AM SORRY TO SEE CHINESE CRAFTSMEN DO THIS SORT OF THING AS THEY HAVE THE SKILL TO MAKE REPLICAS THAT ARE AS GOOD AS OR IN SOME CASES BETTER THAN THE ORIGINAL ITEMS.
I LOOK ON MAKEING SOMETHING CHEAP AND POORLY MADE AS A EPIC LOSS OF FACE ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU CAN DUPLICATE A MASTERPIECE SO WELL THAT IT TAKES AN EXPERT TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE. I CAN ADMIRE THE WORKMANSHIP ON A GOOD DUPLICATE AS MUCH AS I DO THE ORIGINAL AND WILL PAY A FAIR PRICE FOR THAT WORKMANSHIP AND SKILL. WHERE I GET ANGRY IS WHEN A REPLICA IS DESCRIBED AS ORIGINAL AND PRICELESS WHEN I KNOW OTHERWISE. CHINAS REPUTATION (FACE) HAS SUFFERED FROM THIS FOR A LONG TIME BUT AT LEAST THE ITEMS WERE WELL MADE USING THE PROPER MATERIALS AND TECKNIQUES TO DUPLICATE CLOSELY REAL WORKS OF ART. THIS IS GOOD AS EVERYONE CAN'T OWN THE ONE ORIGINAL BUT CAN OWN AND ADMIRE THE ART EVEN IN A CLOSE REPLICA.
THE USE OF INFERIOR MATERIALS AND FANTASY DESIGNS REPRESENTED AS REAL ARTEFACTS IS SHAMEFUL AND A BIG STEP DOWN WHEN THEY CAN DO SO MUCH BETTER.

[laEspadaAncha]

Originally Posted by VANDOO

I AM SORRY TO SEE CHINESE CRAFTSMEN DO THIS SORT OF THING AS THEY HAVE THE SKILL TO MAKE REPLICAS THAT ARE AS GOOD AS OR IN SOME CASES BETTER THAN THE ORIGINAL ITEMS.

This has always been no small source of irony for me.

With a 5,000 year-old tradtion of metworking, it is a sad commentary that we most often attach to a Chinese attribution such modifiers as "fake" and "junk."



ETA: From the "ones that got away" file:

I once had a Luristan dagger/short sword that still had its original ivory inserts (on both sides)... It was one of two pcs. in the lot, the other described as Mycenaean, both from the same ex-Christie's lot. I sold the former to pay for keeping the latter, though I wish in hindsight I had sold something else instead...

[David R]

While we are on the subject of replica bronzes, here's one I bought in Denmark. Sold to me as a Museum REPLICA and one of a limited run, cast from an excavated original.

[bluelake]

Originally Posted by VANDOO

THE LAST PICTURE POSTED IN THIS THREAD APPEARS TO BE A GOOD BRONZE REPLICA CHINESE SWORD I HAVE SEEN MANY SUCH ITEMS AND THE ONES I HAVE HAD FOR MANY YEARS HAVE NEVER DEFORMED OR CRACKED.

Yes, it is an excellent replica, which is why I use it in my Korean history and culture classes as a show-and-tell item regarding bronze weapons.

HERE ARE PICTURES OF THE GREEK LETTEROPENER (SORRY FOR THE POOR QUALITY PICTURES I TRIED SEVERAL TIMES BUT THESE WERE THE BEST I COULD DO AND I DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO LIGHTEN OR INHANCE CONTRAST). THIS GREEK ITEM IS MADE OF A POOR TYPE OF POT METAL AND WILL NOT DRAW A MAGNET THE PATINA HAS BEEN APPLIED TO THE OUTSIDE THE INSIDE RESEMBLES YOUR ITEM IN COLOR. NOTE THE BLADE HAS BENT AND IS BRITTLE THE TIP BROKE OFF SO IT CAN'T BE STRAIGHTENED. THERE ARE CRACKS THRU OUT AND IT CONTINUES TO DEGRADE.

When I lived in Greece (exchange student back in the 70s), I picked up a really nice letter opener from an outdoor seller. It was the family's go-to opener and is still in excellent shape.

I LIKE THE OLD SOLID BRONZE CHINESE REPLICAS BUT DO NOT LIKE THE POTMETAL SOUVINEER FOR OBVIOUS REASONS. I AM SORRY TO SEE CHINESE CRAFTSMEN DO THIS SORT OF THING AS THEY HAVE THE SKILL TO MAKE REPLICAS THAT ARE AS GOOD AS OR IN SOME CASES BETTER THAN THE ORIGINAL ITEMS.

Agreed.

I CAN ADMIRE THE WORKMANSHIP ON A GOOD DUPLICATE AS MUCH AS I DO THE ORIGINAL AND WILL PAY A FAIR PRICE FOR THAT WORKMANSHIP AND SKILL. WHERE I GET ANGRY IS WHEN A REPLICA IS DESCRIBED AS ORIGINAL AND PRICELESS WHEN I KNOW OTHERWISE.

Same here. I will happily pay a fair price for a quality repro, which is billed as such. If one just prices the cost of copper, just the intrinsic value of a good bronze can be quite a bit; if it is also a fine piece of art, the value can easily be a lot more.