ISLAMIC TRANSLATION REQUEST ON A RENTJONG

asomotif · 12th July 2011, 12:28 AM

Dear forumites.

I have a translation request. islamic script, but maybe tekst in jawi or malay ?
The rentjong was given by a local ruler to a dutch lady in 1928 and is claimed to be from approx 1860.

Your help is much appreciated.
I will post pictures of the entire piece in detail later.

Thanks and best regards,
Willem

Maurice · 12th July 2011, 05:56 AM

Hi Willem

can't help you with the translation......but........what a beautifull rencong.

Totally golden handle!
I've never handled such one before, and only have seen a few before on the internet, but from latter age, and far from as beautifull and old as yours!
You lucky you!!

Would love to see more images.

Rg,
Maurice

A.alnakkas · 12th July 2011, 07:18 AM

hmmm, I can red the top word, its "alamat" which means sign or symbol. The rest doesnt make sense to me.

Dom · 12th July 2011, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

hmmm, I can red the top word, its "alamat" which means sign or symbol. The rest doesnt make sense to me.

Hi Lotfi
I am agree with you, it's what ever they want excepted Arabic language

may be "alamat" shoul be "adamet" but ... no meaning according to us

best regards

à +

Dom

asomotif · 12th July 2011, 09:46 PM

Dear Lofti / Dom,

Thank you for your reactions.
So it is not arabic Language.

But the script is arabic I assume ?
I will check if Mohd, Tunggulametung or Jentayu can assist.

Best regards,
Willem

Battara · 12th July 2011, 11:17 PM

Yes the script is Arabic but may be in Achenese = Jawi.

BTW - would you post pictures of the whole thing please!

Dom · 13th July 2011, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

But the script is arabic I assume ?

Hi Willem
you are correct, the script use the Arabic alphabet, as well as
- Persian ... but unreadable for Arabs
- Ottoman ... but unreadable for Arabs
and I may continuous the list

like as Frenchy, I'm using the same alphabet than you Dutch, but not for the same language

have a nice evening

à +

Dom

asomotif · 13th July 2011, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom

like as Frenchy, I'm using the same alphabet than you Dutch, but not for the same language

have a nice evening

à +

Dom

C'est bien noté

asomotif · 13th July 2011, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Yes the script is Arabic but may be in Achenese = Jawi.

BTW - would you post pictures of the whole thing please!

Here is the whole thing.

Battara · 13th July 2011, 03:35 AM

Thank you. What a nice piece. Is it gold or gilt?

mohd · 13th July 2011, 04:59 AM

Hi Willem,

Congrats to you!
It sure is a beautiful piece

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

.. islamic script, but maybe tekst in jawi or malay ?
The rentjong was given by a local ruler to a dutch lady in 1928 and is claimed to be from approx 1860 ..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

.. Yes the script is Arabic but may be in Achenese = Jawi ..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom

.. the script use the Arabic alphabet ..

It is Acehnese language written in Jawi script (i.e. originally is Arabic script).

The first line عـﻼ مـت read "alamt" which is a word that means address or sign or symbol.

عـ ± a
ﻼ‎ ± la
مـ ± m
ـت‎ ± t

The second line تــكــو يــون read "Tku (i.e. Teuku or Teku) Yun" which is a two words name of a person.

تـ ± t
ـكـ ± k
ـو ± u

and

يـ ± y
ـو ± u
ن ± n (i.e. It is placed at the above of the first two alphabets but the dot on the top of the alphabet itself is missing though; anyhow without doubt the very basic stroke of the alphabet is clearly shown as ن ± n in there)

The third line is a Jawi script س which represent ســنــة (i.e. Arabic "sanah") which means year and followed by the year 1348 (i.e. 1929) or 1318 (i.e. 1900).

١ = 1
٣ = 3
٤ = 4 or ١ = 1
٨ = 8

What's the meaning of the whole scripts?
IMVHO it might means that the Rencong was originally belong to or made for (i.e. "alamt") Teuku Yun and the Rencong or the rehandling of the Rencong was made in 1900 or 1929.
Teuku Yun is strictly Acehnese name.
Teuku is a male royal title in Aceh (i.e. equivalence to Prince) who might be a local ruler of a certain district during those olden days.

Hope this helps you a little, Willem

mohd

Battara · 13th July 2011, 05:21 AM

Thank you Mohd. Great job! Information like this helps with researching all our pieces.

asomotif · 13th July 2011, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Thank you. What a nice piece. Is it gold or gilt?

It is massive, but not tested yet.

asomotif · 13th July 2011, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mohd

Hope this helps you a little, Willem

mohd

Thank you very much.

It helps a lot !

erikscollectables · 13th July 2011, 07:30 PM

Congratulations, was already wondering who got it - it was already gone when I saw it. Superb piece and now with a name lucky catch!

I am quite sure it will be massive gold of 18k or more but it will have a resin or horn base on which this is put so not the whole handle is gold but still a nice amount of high grade gold!

All the best, Erik

Jonno · 14th July 2011, 06:32 AM

Very nice piece Willem.
Congratulations
Best,
John

kai · 14th July 2011, 10:00 AM

Congrats, Willem!

Since nobody mentioned it: I'm standing first in line if you ever dicide to let it go...

Regards,
Kai

VVV · 14th July 2011, 10:48 AM

Nice catch Willem,

I also followed the auction but the pictures were to bad and it was too much descriptions in Dutch for me to join.

Congratulations!

Michael

asomotif · 14th July 2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

Congrats, Willem!

Since nobody mentioned it: I'm standing first in line if you ever dicide to let it go...

Regards,
Kai

Thanks Kai,
I am afraid you are already second in line

Best regards,
Willem

asomotif · 14th July 2011, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

Nice catch Willem,

I also followed the auction but the pictures were to bad and it was too much descriptions in Dutch for me to join.

Congratulations!

Michael

Pfew !!! lucky me, that kept the price a little bit down.

Indeed they used old pictures from 2004 when the piece was taxated by Jaap Polak (A'dam antique dealer).
That was my luck and also the seller was 20 minute drive from my home.
From just the pictures I would not have bought it either.

Thanks and best regards,
Willem

VVV · 14th July 2011, 01:05 PM

Obviously this nice rencong already had your name on it.

Michael

asomotif · 4th September 2016, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

It is massive, but not tested yet.

I had the gold tested today with x-ray technique.
56 % gold = approx 13 K.

Best regards,
Willem

Battara · 5th September 2016, 04:59 AM

Thank you Willem.

When I grow up, I'll get one of these in gold. I guess that the gold content must be that low in order to do the heat for the enamel work, and be sturdy enough for use.

Ian · 5th September 2016, 05:22 AM

Willem,

Congratulations on an outstanding purchase. Beautiful rencong. Definitely a keeper.

kai · 10th September 2016, 07:50 PM

Hello Willem,

Quote:

I had the gold tested today with x-ray technique.
56 % gold = approx 13 K.

Thanks for the additional info!

BTW, what are the amounts of the other metals utilized with this alloy?

Regards,
Kai

asomotif · 10th September 2016, 11:30 PM

Pfew, I did not write them down.

There was a lot of silver, some copper and zinc, and to my surprise also a bit of lead approx 1%
Maybe the lead content was caused by the enamel

Battara · 12th September 2016, 04:03 PM

I am not surprised at all about the silver and copper, slightly surprised about the zinc.

You might be right about the lead in the glass enamel..........

asomotif · 9th September 2024, 01:04 AM

Pfew, that was quit a few years ago that I had this rentjong tested.

Today I had it tested again, I brought only the small round cap from the back allowing to test the outside with the enamel, and the inside without enamel.

Here are the results.

asomotif · 9th September 2024, 01:06 AM

adding the pictures

12th July 2011, 12:28 AM	#1
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	JAWI? MALAY ? TRANSLATION REQUEST ON A RENTJONG Dear forumites. I have a translation request. islamic script, but maybe tekst in jawi or malay ? The rentjong was given by a local ruler to a dutch lady in 1928 and is claimed to be from approx 1860. Your help is much appreciated. I will post pictures of the entire piece in detail later. Thanks and best regards, Willem Attached Images Last edited by asomotif; 12th July 2011 at 09:32 PM.

9th September 2024, 01:06 AM	#29
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	adding the pictures Attached Images

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12th July 2011, 05:56 AM	#2
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,462	Hi Willem can't help you with the translation......but........what a beautifull rencong. Totally golden handle! I've never handled such one before, and only have seen a few before on the internet, but from latter age, and far from as beautifull and old as yours! You lucky you!! Would love to see more images. Rg, Maurice

12th July 2011, 07:18 AM	#3
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	hmmm, I can red the top word, its "alamat" which means sign or symbol. The rest doesnt make sense to me.

12th July 2011, 09:46 PM	#5
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	Dear Lofti / Dom, Thank you for your reactions. So it is not arabic Language. But the script is arabic I assume ? I will check if Mohd, Tunggulametung or Jentayu can assist. Best regards, Willem

12th July 2011, 11:17 PM	#6
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Yes the script is Arabic but may be in Achenese = Jawi. BTW - would you post pictures of the whole thing please!

13th July 2011, 03:35 AM	#10
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Thank you. What a nice piece. Is it gold or gilt?

13th July 2011, 05:21 AM	#12
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Thank you Mohd. Great job! Information like this helps with researching all our pieces.

13th July 2011, 07:30 PM	#15
erikscollectables Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 318	Congratulations, was already wondering who got it - it was already gone when I saw it. Superb piece and now with a name lucky catch! I am quite sure it will be massive gold of 18k or more but it will have a resin or horn base on which this is put so not the whole handle is gold but still a nice amount of high grade gold! All the best, Erik

14th July 2011, 06:32 AM	#16
Jonno Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 51	Very nice piece Willem. Congratulations Best, John

14th July 2011, 10:00 AM	#17
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Congrats, Willem! Since nobody mentioned it: I'm standing first in line if you ever dicide to let it go... Regards, Kai

14th July 2011, 10:48 AM	#18
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Nice catch Willem, I also followed the auction but the pictures were to bad and it was too much descriptions in Dutch for me to join. Congratulations! Michael

14th July 2011, 01:05 PM	#21
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Obviously this nice rencong already had your name on it. Michael

5th September 2016, 04:59 AM	#23
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Thank you Willem. When I grow up, I'll get one of these in gold. I guess that the gold content must be that low in order to do the heat for the enamel work, and be sturdy enough for use.

5th September 2016, 05:22 AM	#24
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,521	Willem, Congratulations on an outstanding purchase. Beautiful rencong. Definitely a keeper.

10th September 2016, 11:30 PM	#26
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	Pfew, I did not write them down. There was a lot of silver, some copper and zinc, and to my surprise also a bit of lead approx 1% Maybe the lead content was caused by the enamel

12th September 2016, 04:03 PM	#27
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	I am not surprised at all about the silver and copper, slightly surprised about the zinc. You might be right about the lead in the glass enamel..........

9th September 2024, 01:04 AM	#28
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	Pfew, that was quit a few years ago that I had this rentjong tested. Today I had it tested again, I brought only the small round cap from the back allowing to test the outside with the enamel, and the inside without enamel. Here are the results.