On the Origins of the so-called Berber Sabres

Jim McDougall · 17th August 2009, 10:51 PM

Thank you so much for posting this Teodor!!! The subject of these weapons has often been a topic over many years and remains, along with others, somewhat unresolved. Tirri suggests these sabres are of Spanish Morocco regions, and when these first came into the collecting community nearing two decades ago, they were typically represented as Berber and of regions of the Rif.
The blades seem to invariably have had the curiously profiled tip, that was usually on a British M1796 light cavalry sabre blade. The guardless grip of course recalls the similar form of the eastern cousins of these, the flyssa of the Kabyles and contiguous Berber groups.
On these blades I have seen markings that suggest Spanish provenance, and after the Napoleonic campaigns in the Peninsula, there were considerable numbers of these British blades present that could easily have been sent to Spanish colonies in Morocco. There were also considerable numbers of the British patterns sent to Portugal.

Of further note, is that many of these sabres have turned up in groupings of Spanish colonial weapons, in Mexican collections, and there are suggestions of these being of Cuban and provenance to the America's. I would point out that the shellguard weapon at the top is of a form recently discovered to be an interesting amalgam of espada ancha and these types of sabres, now revealed to be the Brazilian form of these weapons. Note the niche at the top of the grip reflecting this characteristic in the well known Moroccan sa'if known as 'nimcha'.

I have seen suggestions of even associations with the decor of these sabres
to Indonesian and possibly Phillipine archipelagos, which may be supported by the trade and colonial routes of Spain.

Ariel, excellent note on that painting reflecting presence of these swords in use! I would love to see that painting, and as you well point out, Spain and France both had profound presence in these regions. I think one of the most puzzling factors concerning these 'Berber sabres' is that they are notably absent from all the comprehensive collections and resources on the arms of Morocco or North Africa. Charles Buttin, the highly esteemed collector and authority of weapons of the end of the 19th century and into the 20th has no example of these in his incredibly comprehensive catalog, nor are these seen in Holstein, Alain, Moser or other prominent collections.

There is the mystery...why? and we really need to reach the museums of Morocco and others in these regions to see if provenanced examples can be found.

All best regards,
Jim

17th August 2009, 10:51 PM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,192	Thank you so much for posting this Teodor!!! The subject of these weapons has often been a topic over many years and remains, along with others, somewhat unresolved. Tirri suggests these sabres are of Spanish Morocco regions, and when these first came into the collecting community nearing two decades ago, they were typically represented as Berber and of regions of the Rif. The blades seem to invariably have had the curiously profiled tip, that was usually on a British M1796 light cavalry sabre blade. The guardless grip of course recalls the similar form of the eastern cousins of these, the flyssa of the Kabyles and contiguous Berber groups. On these blades I have seen markings that suggest Spanish provenance, and after the Napoleonic campaigns in the Peninsula, there were considerable numbers of these British blades present that could easily have been sent to Spanish colonies in Morocco. There were also considerable numbers of the British patterns sent to Portugal. Of further note, is that many of these sabres have turned up in groupings of Spanish colonial weapons, in Mexican collections, and there are suggestions of these being of Cuban and provenance to the America's. I would point out that the shellguard weapon at the top is of a form recently discovered to be an interesting amalgam of espada ancha and these types of sabres, now revealed to be the Brazilian form of these weapons. Note the niche at the top of the grip reflecting this characteristic in the well known Moroccan sa'if known as 'nimcha'. I have seen suggestions of even associations with the decor of these sabres to Indonesian and possibly Phillipine archipelagos, which may be supported by the trade and colonial routes of Spain. Ariel, excellent note on that painting reflecting presence of these swords in use! I would love to see that painting, and as you well point out, Spain and France both had profound presence in these regions. I think one of the most puzzling factors concerning these 'Berber sabres' is that they are notably absent from all the comprehensive collections and resources on the arms of Morocco or North Africa. Charles Buttin, the highly esteemed collector and authority of weapons of the end of the 19th century and into the 20th has no example of these in his incredibly comprehensive catalog, nor are these seen in Holstein, Alain, Moser or other prominent collections. There is the mystery...why? and we really need to reach the museums of Morocco and others in these regions to see if provenanced examples can be found. All best regards, Jim Last edited by Jim McDougall; 17th August 2009 at 11:02 PM.