Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Keris Warung Kopi
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 30th July 2025, 09:58 PM   #1
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default Jawa keris pamor Adeg

Hi
I seek views on this keris please. 36.5cm blade with pamor adeg in very very high relief. Apart from this the blade is waxy smooth. One piece scabbard with chatoyant timber. The pesi is completely encased in matted human hair even at its end. No cloth or other binding used at all. Any thoughts on age, dhapur and quality?
Attached Images
      
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 12:52 AM   #2
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,047
Default

A lot of people would call this pamor "Singkir" & immediately place it as Madura.

I am not able to be certain if working from photos, but I believe that in the hand I would not place this as Madura, but perhaps Central Jawa to East Jawa, meaning geographically anywhere between Solo & Surabaya. There does seem to be a Surakarta influence, but again, impossible to be sure from photos.

Age I think anywhere from mid-19th century to 1930's.

Present dress pre-WWII.

Dhapur originally made as Tilam Upih, however, at one time during its life it was found necessary --- or maybe somebody became careless --- & it got a pretty long bath in acid, that provided the high relief in the grain, it was then necessary to clean up the edges of the blade.

Being really strict we'd need to consider the overall state of preservation a bit deficient, but being a bit more relaxed we could think of the end result as pretty OK.

Not a bad Javanese "everyman's" keris.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 01:14 AM   #3
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default

Thanks Alan
One thing I don't grasp is that if it was left in acid for too long then I would've thought the texture would be rough like sandpaper. It's waxy smooth though all over. No roughness at all. Can you achieve this with a long dip in acid?
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 02:20 AM   #4
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,047
Default

If a blade comes out of the cleaning bath with a rough texture you clean it off with an abrasive, in Bali they mostly use wet sand followed by limestone powder, in Solo I think most people use wet sand followed by "abu gosok" this is ash of, I'm not sure what, I think maybe kayu glugu --- coconut palm --- we use coconut husk fibre as the carrier.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 11:11 AM   #5
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default

Thanks Alan,
So it's not the norm for this type of texture to be deliberately sought? It's unintended? And is the hair on the pesi of any note? The scabbard is a perfect fit and the blade slides in and locks in place but can still be removed easily as needed. Is pamor singkir a subset of Adeg or totally different? There's not a lot out there on its properties. Sorry for the multiple questions.
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 11:18 AM   #6
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default

Pic of ganja also textured in scabbard.
Attached Images
 
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 11:28 AM   #7
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default

I think the mendak is silver.
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 01:46 PM   #8
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,047
Default

This high relief contrast is not sought, it happens unintentionally.

In the past hair was sometimes used to provide a pressure fit for the hilt. There are number of beliefs as to why, nothing is definite --- except for the personal belief of the person who used hair instead of something else.

Singkir is the name of a pande keris, or mpu, who was known for making pamor adeg.

Some people call Pamor Adeg, Pamor Singkir, two names for the same motif. This is not unusual, motifs can sometimes be known by different names.

Actually there were a couple of Mpu Singkirs, one was around in the last days of Mojopahit, then he moved to Blambangan, the other one was a Pajajaran mpu who was also known as Mpu Anggo, & Mpu Anggo was also known as Mpu Tapak. In the Silsilah Mpu Tanah Jawa, Singkir is known as Mpu Anggo, but Anggo was also known as Tapan, Joko Piturah, Wonoboyo, & Tapak.

Probably a good attitude when dealing with keris & keris makers & beliefs not to get the idea that anything at all is graven in stone.

Javanese people frequently have more than a single name, they are given a name by their parents at birth, but that name is often changed according to the circumstances of their life. Sometimes they can be known by different names at the same time, depending upon what group they are involved with. For example, a person might be a bank clerk, & at work & with his work acquaintances he might be known as Mr. A, but he also belongs to a motor club, & in that club he is known as Mr. B, but apart from motor cars, he also has an interest in singing birds, & with that group he is Mr.C.

Then we have the situation where he uses only one name, but spells & pronounces it in different ways. In the present day all Indonesians must have an official name & carry an identity card, & that official name is usually quite different to any other names a person might have.

To survive in Javanese society one needs to fairly flexible in the understanding of naming mores, it is necessary to be able to move easily from one apparent situation to a different apparent situation, neither of which might have a lot to do the situation that one is currently experiencing.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2025, 02:51 PM   #9
SidJ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 222
Default

Thank you Alan,
Very grateful as always for your valuable insights.
Best wishes
SidJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.