Tulwar with some unusual modifications

blue lander · 29th May 2014, 09:48 PM

I just won an auction for this tulwar for a very cheap price for obvious reasons. I can't make heads or tails of these auction pictures. It looks like the end of the hilt has been replaced with a drawer knob. It also looks like a pin has been pushed through the hilt into the tang.
It does look like the patina on the blade and the hilt are consistent, so I assume these modifications were made a long time ago.
Can anybody tell me anything else about this Tulwar?

Edit: Now I'm wondering if the knob on the end is original. Here's a couple threads with similar hilts

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?p=148296
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t=tulwar+hilts

Jim McDougall · 30th May 2014, 06:02 PM

I think you're on track with your assessment on this most unusual and apparently altered tulwar as this pommel seems quite disproportionate .
Thank you for sharing your preliminary findings and thoughts as well, that is a most helpful approach to initiate discussion ... excellent!!!

I am inclined to agree that this 'pommel' seems to be some sort of ersatz replacement using a knob or fixture not intended originally for use on a hilt.
It seems that tribal artisans in regions of India's northwest have always been extremely innovative in refurbishing weapons. It would seem that a 'rugged' and rather obvious fabrication like this would be more likely to have been an authentic 'field' adjustment as opposed to a more 'commercial' product.

While pretty rough, these kinds of examples are always intriguing, as trying to imagine the circumstances in which it became in its present form and condition lend to fascinating possibilities.

blue lander · 30th May 2014, 06:29 PM

Thank you. My other thought is that perhaps it was modified deliberately by some westerner who found the disc uncomfortable and wanted a little extra length in the grip. But if that was the case they probably would have done a tidier job.

Not to digress from the topic at hand, but here's a European looking dagger that appeared to have a dresser drawer knob for a pommel as well. Maybe it's just coincidence. I didn't win the auction for it unfortunately.

Jim McDougall · 30th May 2014, 07:02 PM

It seems that there are a number of examples of tulwar from Afghan regions which are sans pommel disc, and in discussions it was sometimes suggested that Afghans were inclined to have much larger hands than the Indian warriors to the south. Perhaps such replacement or adjustment might have been warranted in accord with these circumstances. It does seem that in those instances that the pommel area was left open, though some of these seem to actually have never had the pommel disc.

In the case of the dagger noted, I would likely be more suspicious, but the coincidence seems interesting.

David R · 30th May 2014, 08:16 PM

The pin through the grip and tang is also a common Afghan feature....look up pulwar also spelled pulouar.

Jens Nordlunde · 30th May 2014, 09:48 PM

The pin was also used by the Indians, but it was mostly hidden by the hilt decoration.
Jens

29th May 2014, 09:48 PM	#1
blue lander Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 456	Tulwar with some unusual modifications I just won an auction for this tulwar for a very cheap price for obvious reasons. I can't make heads or tails of these auction pictures. It looks like the end of the hilt has been replaced with a drawer knob. It also looks like a pin has been pushed through the hilt into the tang. It does look like the patina on the blade and the hilt are consistent, so I assume these modifications were made a long time ago. Can anybody tell me anything else about this Tulwar? Edit: Now I'm wondering if the knob on the end is original. Here's a couple threads with similar hilts http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?p=148296 http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t=tulwar+hilts Attached Images Last edited by blue lander; 30th May 2014 at 05:03 PM.

30th May 2014, 06:29 PM	#3
blue lander Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 456	Thank you. My other thought is that perhaps it was modified deliberately by some westerner who found the disc uncomfortable and wanted a little extra length in the grip. But if that was the case they probably would have done a tidier job. Not to digress from the topic at hand, but here's a European looking dagger that appeared to have a dresser drawer knob for a pommel as well. Maybe it's just coincidence. I didn't win the auction for it unfortunately. Attached Images

30th May 2014, 06:02 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,800	I think you're on track with your assessment on this most unusual and apparently altered tulwar as this pommel seems quite disproportionate . Thank you for sharing your preliminary findings and thoughts as well, that is a most helpful approach to initiate discussion ... excellent!!! I am inclined to agree that this 'pommel' seems to be some sort of ersatz replacement using a knob or fixture not intended originally for use on a hilt. It seems that tribal artisans in regions of India's northwest have always been extremely innovative in refurbishing weapons. It would seem that a 'rugged' and rather obvious fabrication like this would be more likely to have been an authentic 'field' adjustment as opposed to a more 'commercial' product. While pretty rough, these kinds of examples are always intriguing, as trying to imagine the circumstances in which it became in its present form and condition lend to fascinating possibilities.

30th May 2014, 07:02 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,800	It seems that there are a number of examples of tulwar from Afghan regions which are sans pommel disc, and in discussions it was sometimes suggested that Afghans were inclined to have much larger hands than the Indian warriors to the south. Perhaps such replacement or adjustment might have been warranted in accord with these circumstances. It does seem that in those instances that the pommel area was left open, though some of these seem to actually have never had the pommel disc. In the case of the dagger noted, I would likely be more suspicious, but the coincidence seems interesting.

30th May 2014, 08:16 PM	#5
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,059	The pin through the grip and tang is also a common Afghan feature....look up pulwar also spelled pulouar.

30th May 2014, 09:48 PM	#6
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,713	The pin was also used by the Indians, but it was mostly hidden by the hilt decoration. Jens