A Large Spanish Cup Hilt

CSinTX · 19th January 2016, 12:24 AM

I recently added this piece to my collection. The cup is in damaged condition but it would be way above my pay grade if it were in perfect shape. It's still quite impressive either way. Excellent workmanship! Blade inscription reads- "Acomete Quien Quiera" "El Fuerte Espera". Large cup with large heavy quillons. It measures 125cm.

As always, any and all thoughts are appreciated.

fernando · 19th January 2016, 12:12 PM

Outstanding find, CSinTX.
A very impressive and rather lengthy example.
I wish i had one of these

.
17th century, i wold guess. The inscription is very Castillian; this would be a Toledo sword.

cornelistromp · 19th January 2016, 01:05 PM

@ Fernando, yes you are right in "Diccionario de la lengua castellana"

is written Acomete Quien Quiera , El Fuerte Espera =en que se advierte que es mas valor esperar con serenidad peligro , que acometer

my Spanish is not so good, this is an understatement and correct me if I'm wrong, I think it means something like;

that It warns/says that it is more valuable to wait calmly and that is dangerous to rush.

very nice cup hilt rapier btw.

best,
Jasper

ulfberth · 19th January 2016, 02:18 PM

Casey,

congratulations with this fine pierced cup hilt rapier !

Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera is a proverb written by César Oudin in 1609.

https://resdiachronicae.files.wordpr...pablo_luis.pdf

Proverbe en espagnol : « Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera. »
Traduction française : « Attaque qui voudra, le brave l'attendra. »

So free translated it means , Attack whoever wants, the brave are waiting !

I can only imagine what the owner must have felt holding this rapier in his hands while these lyrics went trough his mind ...

Kind Regards

Ulfberth

Jim McDougall · 20th January 2016, 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulfberth

Casey,

congratulations with this fine pierced cup hilt rapier !

Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera is a proverb written by César Oudin in 1609.

https://resdiachronicae.files.wordpr...pablo_luis.pdf

Proverbe en espagnol : « Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera. »
Traduction française : « Attaque qui voudra, le brave l'attendra. »

So free translated it means , Attack whoever wants, the brave are waiting !

I can only imagine what the owner must have felt holding this rapier in his hands while these lyrics went trough his mind ...

Kind Regards

Ulfberth

Outstanding entry noting the source for this quote and the translation!!
What a beautiful cup hilt!
Thank you for adding that on the translation Ulfberth

ulfberth · 20th January 2016, 05:48 PM

Thanks Jim !

This cup hilt has it all, beautifully chiseled guard and pommel, finely pierced cup and an inspiring proverb on the blade.
What also intrigues me is the shell shape ends on the pas dane, this is a design I have seen on 16th pommels.
Can this design perhaps be related to a certain area or origin ?

kind regards

Ulfberth

fernando · 19th January 2016, 02:28 PM

You are closest from it, Jasper.
A strict translation (through portuguese) would be:
Whoever it is may atack but ... the strong (brave) waits.
The interpretation being: it is foolish to atack; better calmly wait.

fernando · 19th January 2016, 02:32 PM

Casey, have you lurked inside the guard, both sides of the ricasso; to check whether there are any smiths marks ?

19th January 2016, 12:24 AM	#1
CSinTX Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Posts: 233	A Large Spanish Cup Hilt I recently added this piece to my collection. The cup is in damaged condition but it would be way above my pay grade if it were in perfect shape. It's still quite impressive either way. Excellent workmanship! Blade inscription reads- "Acomete Quien Quiera" "El Fuerte Espera". Large cup with large heavy quillons. It measures 125cm. As always, any and all thoughts are appreciated. Attached Images

20th January 2016, 05:48 PM	#6
ulfberth Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 382	Thanks Jim ! This cup hilt has it all, beautifully chiseled guard and pommel, finely pierced cup and an inspiring proverb on the blade. What also intrigues me is the shell shape ends on the pas dane, this is a design I have seen on 16th pommels. Can this design perhaps be related to a certain area or origin ? kind regards Ulfberth Attached Images

19th January 2016, 12:12 PM	#2
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,654	Outstanding find, CSinTX. A very impressive and rather lengthy example. I wish i had one of these . 17th century, i wold guess. The inscription is very Castillian; this would be a Toledo sword.

19th January 2016, 01:05 PM	#3
cornelistromp Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,057	@ Fernando, yes you are right in "Diccionario de la lengua castellana" is written Acomete Quien Quiera , El Fuerte Espera =en que se advierte que es mas valor esperar con serenidad peligro , que acometer my Spanish is not so good, this is an understatement and correct me if I'm wrong, I think it means something like; that It warns/says that it is more valuable to wait calmly and that is dangerous to rush. very nice cup hilt rapier btw. best, Jasper

19th January 2016, 02:18 PM	#4
ulfberth Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 382	Casey, congratulations with this fine pierced cup hilt rapier ! Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera is a proverb written by César Oudin in 1609. https://resdiachronicae.files.wordpr...pablo_luis.pdf Proverbe en espagnol : « Acometa quien quiera, el fuerte espera. » Traduction française : « Attaque qui voudra, le brave l'attendra. » So free translated it means , Attack whoever wants, the brave are waiting ! I can only imagine what the owner must have felt holding this rapier in his hands while these lyrics went trough his mind ... Kind Regards Ulfberth

19th January 2016, 02:28 PM	#7
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,654	You are closest from it, Jasper. A strict translation (through portuguese) would be: Whoever it is may atack but ... the strong (brave) waits. The interpretation being: it is foolish to atack; better calmly wait.

19th January 2016, 02:32 PM	#8
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,654	Casey, have you lurked inside the guard, both sides of the ricasso; to check whether there are any smiths marks ?