Kurdish , persian dagger ?

francantolin · 23rd September 2018, 07:14 AM

Hello everybody,

I bought this small dagger, a khanjar I think.

I wonder about the exact origin and age ?

the leather scabbard look like some kurdish models
the blade maybe persian.

The hilt ( made of walrus ivory ? )
is not sophisticated but I really like it.

It has an interesting shape,
rounded on both side (and on the end of the scabbard ),
uncommon ( at least for me

) in oriental daggers/khanjars

What do you think ?

Kind regards

francantolin · 23rd September 2018, 07:16 AM

These more !

Thank's !

motan · 23rd September 2018, 08:00 AM

Hi Francantolin,

I am not an expert, but this dagger feels Persian to me, not Ottoman or Kurdish. It also looks old and original. The hilt is definitely walrus ivory. The shape of the hilt is uncommon, but other aspects are too. The blade is curved only in the lower third and is mildly curved- most Persian daggers have a sharp curve. The beautiful pattern of the koftgiri is unusual and looks like Indian influence.
It is a bit of a mystery and I am looking forward to what others will say about it.

Kubur · 23rd September 2018, 08:38 AM

Hi
Sorry Motan but I think it's Ottoman and bone...
Best
Kubur

ALEX · 23rd September 2018, 09:29 AM

yes, it is Ottoman dagger. The hilt is walrus. The blade could be Turkish "beyaz" wootz.

Sajen · 23rd September 2018, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Sorry Motan but I think it's Ottoman and bone...

Sorry Kubur,
clearly walrus ivory!

Regards,
Detlef

Kubur · 23rd September 2018, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

Sorry Kubur,
clearly walrus ivory!

Regards,
Detlef

No problem
with the last photos, sold as walrus.

colin henshaw · 23rd September 2018, 09:43 AM

Nice piece, Ottoman with walrus hilt. A bit like this one I had a few years ago.

francantolin · 23rd September 2018, 10:08 AM

Hello,
Really thank you all for all your precious comments !!!
For the hilt, I put two more pictures, I really think it's ivory,
these two pictures look like a teeth and his central core.

The surface is really soft ,
an antique seller told me years ago two tricks for differentiate ivory with bone by touching it: ( sure, it's not enough ! )
1. softness 2 put the piece on your cheek,
ivory is cold and bone ''warm''.
I tried with bone and this one, it seems to work...

francantolin · 23rd September 2018, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by colin henshaw

Nice piece, Ottoman with walrus hilt. A bit like this one I had a few years ago.

Really beautiful !!!!

23rd September 2018, 07:14 AM	#1
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 871	Kurdish , persian dagger ? Hello everybody, I bought this small dagger, a khanjar I think. I wonder about the exact origin and age ? the leather scabbard look like some kurdish models the blade maybe persian. The hilt ( made of walrus ivory ? ) is not sophisticated but I really like it. It has an interesting shape, rounded on both side (and on the end of the scabbard ), uncommon ( at least for me ) in oriental daggers/khanjars What do you think ? Kind regards Attached Images

23rd September 2018, 07:16 AM	#2
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 871	These more ! Thank's ! Attached Images

23rd September 2018, 09:43 AM	#8
colin henshaw Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,430	Nice piece, Ottoman with walrus hilt. A bit like this one I had a few years ago. Attached Images

23rd September 2018, 10:08 AM	#9
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 871	Hello, Really thank you all for all your precious comments !!! For the hilt, I put two more pictures, I really think it's ivory, these two pictures look like a teeth and his central core. The surface is really soft , an antique seller told me years ago two tricks for differentiate ivory with bone by touching it: ( sure, it's not enough ! ) 1. softness 2 put the piece on your cheek, ivory is cold and bone ''warm''. I tried with bone and this one, it seems to work... Attached Images

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23rd September 2018, 08:00 AM	#3
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Francantolin, I am not an expert, but this dagger feels Persian to me, not Ottoman or Kurdish. It also looks old and original. The hilt is definitely walrus ivory. The shape of the hilt is uncommon, but other aspects are too. The blade is curved only in the lower third and is mildly curved- most Persian daggers have a sharp curve. The beautiful pattern of the koftgiri is unusual and looks like Indian influence. It is a bit of a mystery and I am looking forward to what others will say about it.

23rd September 2018, 08:38 AM	#4
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Hi Sorry Motan but I think it's Ottoman and bone... Best Kubur

23rd September 2018, 09:29 AM	#5
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	yes, it is Ottoman dagger. The hilt is walrus. The blade could be Turkish "beyaz" wootz.