Moro Tulip Kris (need Arabic/Jawi translation please)

Battara · 29th January 2015, 01:15 AM

Greetings folks!

I now have this Maguindanao kris I believe from the 1920s. Although the luk curves are sharp, the ganga is separate. No laminations in the blade. The pommel is made of ivory and the mounts are silver (I made the ferrule to match and replace the missing one).

On one side of the blade is a name in Western handwritten script (which I can only make out some of it). On the other side is Arabic or Jawi script. Would someone help me in the translation of the Arabic or Jawi script please? (and also the Western script as well?)

By the way, the script on both sides seems to be made of white metal, odd (and harder to inlay).

Rick · 29th January 2015, 02:51 AM

Very interesting angular point to go along with the sharp luks, Jose .

Battara · 29th January 2015, 05:20 AM

Tru'dat, Rick. I have owned 2 Maguindanao kris in the past that ended in blade points like this, one of which was this one:

Robert · 29th January 2015, 06:45 AM

The tip on the first is even more angular than the tip of the one just posted. While I have seen a few examples very similar to the the second kris posted, this is the first one I have seen where the tip is made with such abrupt angles as those shown on the first piece.
By the way, very nice silverwork on the replacement band, If you had not pointed it out I do not think anyone would have even noticed.

Best,
Robert

Spunjer · 29th January 2015, 07:43 PM

interesting kris! i always associate those pommels as more of a phallic symbol that tulips, lol. i've seen wood, but not ivory. also, i would say that it's older that what you credit it for, jose. turn of the century, at least... nice catch on this one!

regarding the inlay:
can't help you with the Jawi part, but on the western script side, i believe it's a name. if i'm not mistaken, it says: "property of Ron, please return promptly if found". i kid, lol...
seriously, i think it says "J.T. Van Orsdale". J.T., or John Timothy Van Orsdale served under General Woods in Cotabato from 1903 to 1904. he was a colonel, and in charged of the 17th Infantry. after doing his tour, he stayed for another year in Zamboanga. he left mindanao in 1905, and i believe he went to Cuba after that. so going back to the age of this kris, if it's indeed his going away present, that would place this piece around the turn of the century.
another thing; seems to be a common practice back in the day to give a high ranking officer a kris when they leave Mindanao. a similar practice today would be something like this but rather than putting the officer's name on the blade, it's engraved on a plaque. there was another piece that has a name inlayed on it; from Reina Regente i think. i believe it was Ian's piece?
hope this helps

Gustav · 29th January 2015, 07:54 PM

A fantastic provenance. And one more kris, which shows pointy luk already near the turn of the century.

29th January 2015, 01:15 AM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Moro Tulip Kris (need Arabic/Jawi translation please) Greetings folks! I now have this Maguindanao kris I believe from the 1920s. Although the luk curves are sharp, the ganga is separate. No laminations in the blade. The pommel is made of ivory and the mounts are silver (I made the ferrule to match and replace the missing one). On one side of the blade is a name in Western handwritten script (which I can only make out some of it). On the other side is Arabic or Jawi script. Would someone help me in the translation of the Arabic or Jawi script please? (and also the Western script as well?) By the way, the script on both sides seems to be made of white metal, odd (and harder to inlay). Attached Images

29th January 2015, 05:20 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,345	Tru'dat, Rick. I have owned 2 Maguindanao kris in the past that ended in blade points like this, one of which was this one: Attached Images

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29th January 2015, 02:51 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,376	Very interesting angular point to go along with the sharp luks, Jose .

29th January 2015, 06:45 AM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	The tip on the first is even more angular than the tip of the one just posted. While I have seen a few examples very similar to the the second kris posted, this is the first one I have seen where the tip is made with such abrupt angles as those shown on the first piece. By the way, very nice silverwork on the replacement band, If you had not pointed it out I do not think anyone would have even noticed. Best, Robert

29th January 2015, 07:43 PM	#5
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	interesting kris! i always associate those pommels as more of a phallic symbol that tulips, lol. i've seen wood, but not ivory. also, i would say that it's older that what you credit it for, jose. turn of the century, at least... nice catch on this one! regarding the inlay: can't help you with the Jawi part, but on the western script side, i believe it's a name. if i'm not mistaken, it says: "property of Ron, please return promptly if found". i kid, lol... seriously, i think it says "J.T. Van Orsdale". J.T., or John Timothy Van Orsdale served under General Woods in Cotabato from 1903 to 1904. he was a colonel, and in charged of the 17th Infantry. after doing his tour, he stayed for another year in Zamboanga. he left mindanao in 1905, and i believe he went to Cuba after that. so going back to the age of this kris, if it's indeed his going away present, that would place this piece around the turn of the century. another thing; seems to be a common practice back in the day to give a high ranking officer a kris when they leave Mindanao. a similar practice today would be something like this but rather than putting the officer's name on the blade, it's engraved on a plaque. there was another piece that has a name inlayed on it; from Reina Regente i think. i believe it was Ian's piece? hope this helps

29th January 2015, 07:54 PM	#6
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,295	A fantastic provenance. And one more kris, which shows pointy luk already near the turn of the century.