Pre-contact Maori whalebone club

Ron Anderson · 9th September 2010, 01:07 PM

This is a club from a very esteemed collection that went up for auction. Hopefully this means its a good piece. It certainly has providence.

It is unlike any other Maori clubs I know of. Does not conform to the standard types I know. But then I have come across references of clubs that don't.

It is whalebone, and it is old. Very old. I think it is pre-contact.

But I'm anxious to hear what other people think.

This sort of thing is extremely unusual.

It owes me a fair bit of money.

The collection it came from included some of the rarest artefacts I have ever seen – human heads from Borneo, exquisite two metre Benin ivory walking sticks, African ivory war horns, and carved ivory pieces from China that went for tens of thousands of dollars.

Gavin Nugent · 9th September 2010, 02:51 PM

Hi Ron,

I too would be interested in hearing more about this from learned members.
Personally, I do not think this is pre-contact Maori though, my opinion only based on the manner of carving and only seeing an image, I would look to other Islands. Carving aside, the whale bone however does seem to have a lot of age to it and whale bone doesn't come cheap in any form.

PM me if you like as I know a bit more about a number of the items from GES.

Gav

Tim Simmons · 9th September 2010, 05:20 PM

That is very nice indeed. The head is beautifully carved, look at the fine work around the nose. Ron in my opinion this is not Maori or pre contact, as the circle design elements are made with a pair of steel dividers. I think what you have may well be a genuine North American NW Coast piece. You are a very lucky man!!!!!

VANDOO · 9th September 2010, 06:11 PM

I AGREE THAT THIS CLUB MORE CLOSELY RESEMBLES THE WHALEBONE CLUBS FOUND IN THE NORTH WEST COAST OF NORTH AMERICA. THEY ARE GENERALLY A LITTLE LONGER THAN THE MAORI SHORT CLUBS AND YOU SEE VERY FEW OF THEM COMPARED TO THE MAORI CLUBS. WHAT ARE ITS MEASUREMENTS?. SEE THE THREE POSTS ON MAORI SHORT CLUBS FOR PICTURES AND INFO ON MAORI CLUBS. IF THE PROVENANCE IS ACCURATE IT IS POSSIBLE TO BE MAORI BUT FROM LOOKING AT IT AND ITS APPARENT LENGTH I WOULD GO WITH N.W. COAST.
I INCLUDE THREE PICTURES OF TWO WHALEBONE WAR CLUBS N.W. COAST AND A PICTURE OF SEVERAL SNOW KNIVES USED FOR CONSTRUCTION WAY UP NORTH.
EITHER WAY YOU HAVE A VERY RARE AND DESIRABLE CLUB, I HAVE NEVER HAD THE PLEASURE OF HANDELING SUCH A CLUB SO CONGRADULATIONS ON ACTUALLY OWNING ONE, I AM ENVIOUS.

fearn · 9th September 2010, 06:30 PM

I'm also skeptical about a pre-contact age on that club. However, I think it came from the south Pacific, not the Pacific Northwest.

Here's my reasoning:

1. Pre-Contact vs. Post-Contact: The carving looks like it was done with metal tools. Granted, I haven't done any carving on whale bone (for the obvious reason of not having any), but Pre-Contact lines would have been ground and chipped in with stone tools. This tends to make for round bottoms and smooth edges. If you can imagine free-handing those circular incisions using (perhaps) a stick and some sand, or an awl made from something, then you'll see what the issue is. With a metal drill, it's a trivial figure to make. Ditto with the edges around the mouth. Now, if you can see work marks that makes you think someone laboriously incised all that stuff, then Pre-Contact looks more likely.

2. South Pacific vs. North Pacific: to me, it looks like Polynesian work. My thought is that in the early days, a number of Polynesians, including Maori, served on the whaling boats. I could see such a sailor making this club on-board or afterward, using some bone from one of their catches.

That's my 0.0002 pence,

F

Tim Simmons · 9th September 2010, 07:01 PM

Hmmm, back on the made by saliors. From your pictures I cannot see much smoothness from handling. That does not have to mean much. I can see the carving of the face fitting many NW pacific masks. I could see melanesian style carving but the form of the whole thing and the overall shape of the handle part do seem so very similar to many NW Pacific pieces. I think you sould send pics to museums in London and Washington DC.

P.S. I have to say that the quality of the carving suggests a specialist or an artist, at the very least somebody accomplished and used to balancing design.

9th September 2010, 01:07 PM	#1
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	Pre-contact Maori whalebone club This is a club from a very esteemed collection that went up for auction. Hopefully this means its a good piece. It certainly has providence. It is unlike any other Maori clubs I know of. Does not conform to the standard types I know. But then I have come across references of clubs that don't. It is whalebone, and it is old. Very old. I think it is pre-contact. But I'm anxious to hear what other people think. This sort of thing is extremely unusual. It owes me a fair bit of money. The collection it came from included some of the rarest artefacts I have ever seen – human heads from Borneo, exquisite two metre Benin ivory walking sticks, African ivory war horns, and carved ivory pieces from China that went for tens of thousands of dollars. Attached Images

9th September 2010, 02:51 PM	#2
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Interesting Hi Ron, I too would be interested in hearing more about this from learned members. Personally, I do not think this is pre-contact Maori though, my opinion only based on the manner of carving and only seeing an image, I would look to other Islands. Carving aside, the whale bone however does seem to have a lot of age to it and whale bone doesn't come cheap in any form. PM me if you like as I know a bit more about a number of the items from GES. Gav

9th September 2010, 06:11 PM	#4
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	I AGREE THAT THIS CLUB MORE CLOSELY RESEMBLES THE WHALEBONE CLUBS FOUND IN THE NORTH WEST COAST OF NORTH AMERICA. THEY ARE GENERALLY A LITTLE LONGER THAN THE MAORI SHORT CLUBS AND YOU SEE VERY FEW OF THEM COMPARED TO THE MAORI CLUBS. WHAT ARE ITS MEASUREMENTS?. SEE THE THREE POSTS ON MAORI SHORT CLUBS FOR PICTURES AND INFO ON MAORI CLUBS. IF THE PROVENANCE IS ACCURATE IT IS POSSIBLE TO BE MAORI BUT FROM LOOKING AT IT AND ITS APPARENT LENGTH I WOULD GO WITH N.W. COAST. I INCLUDE THREE PICTURES OF TWO WHALEBONE WAR CLUBS N.W. COAST AND A PICTURE OF SEVERAL SNOW KNIVES USED FOR CONSTRUCTION WAY UP NORTH. EITHER WAY YOU HAVE A VERY RARE AND DESIRABLE CLUB, I HAVE NEVER HAD THE PLEASURE OF HANDELING SUCH A CLUB SO CONGRADULATIONS ON ACTUALLY OWNING ONE, I AM ENVIOUS. Attached Images Last edited by VANDOO; 10th September 2010 at 04:52 AM.

9th September 2010, 05:20 PM	#3
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,747	That is very nice indeed. The head is beautifully carved, look at the fine work around the nose. Ron in my opinion this is not Maori or pre contact, as the circle design elements are made with a pair of steel dividers. I think what you have may well be a genuine North American NW Coast piece. You are a very lucky man!!!!!

9th September 2010, 06:30 PM	#5
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	I'm also skeptical about a pre-contact age on that club. However, I think it came from the south Pacific, not the Pacific Northwest. Here's my reasoning: 1. Pre-Contact vs. Post-Contact: The carving looks like it was done with metal tools. Granted, I haven't done any carving on whale bone (for the obvious reason of not having any), but Pre-Contact lines would have been ground and chipped in with stone tools. This tends to make for round bottoms and smooth edges. If you can imagine free-handing those circular incisions using (perhaps) a stick and some sand, or an awl made from something, then you'll see what the issue is. With a metal drill, it's a trivial figure to make. Ditto with the edges around the mouth. Now, if you can see work marks that makes you think someone laboriously incised all that stuff, then Pre-Contact looks more likely. 2. South Pacific vs. North Pacific: to me, it looks like Polynesian work. My thought is that in the early days, a number of Polynesians, including Maori, served on the whaling boats. I could see such a sailor making this club on-board or afterward, using some bone from one of their catches. That's my 0.0002 pence, F

9th September 2010, 07:01 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,747	Hmmm, back on the made by saliors. From your pictures I cannot see much smoothness from handling. That does not have to mean much. I can see the carving of the face fitting many NW pacific masks. I could see melanesian style carving but the form of the whole thing and the overall shape of the handle part do seem so very similar to many NW Pacific pieces. I think you sould send pics to museums in London and Washington DC. P.S. I have to say that the quality of the carving suggests a specialist or an artist, at the very least somebody accomplished and used to balancing design.