Unknown Spanish colonial or Mexican Basket Hilted sabre

[Magey_McMage]

Hello everyone, apologies if any of this is rude or unorthodox as it is my first post on the forum here. I have gone by the same on the SBG forum (please do not construe this as an advertisement or otherwise, hopefully just trying to provide some context for my sudden appearance) for a number of years now but due to this current sword's mystery alongside wishing to try and expand my education I created an account here. I normally say I focus on later Victorian era military sabres, but let me be honest I get anything I think looks cool or can otherwise afford. Currently, British, French, Italian, Swiss, and Swedish are the majority of my focus in order of decreasing importance with an emphasis on non regulation and unusual swords such as patent solid hilts for the Brits, 'fantaisie' or North African non regulation for the French, and other similar applications of the same spirit for other countries.

I recently won a sword at the last Bonhams that is still being shipped, so it has not arrived yet. Ideally it will be here before the end of next week but while I wait I have been doing as much research as I can.

The description states as follows:

A SPANISH COLONIAL SILVER HILTED OFFICER'S SWORD,
19th century.
Silver hilt with narrow counter-guard mounting five intertwined branches, three with applied flaming bomb emblems, knuckle bow with foliate decoration where it joins the pommel cap above a spiral carved wood grip with twisted iron wire; straight double-edge blade with two narrow fuller and etched inscription "ME SENAL ES EL CAVISCO DEL VOY/[---] EN ALEMANIA SOLICE ANO 1720."


I found your great thread here: https://vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=24378 which gave me lots of useful information, I did not want to risk breaking any rules by necro-ing it some 7 years later.

Like those, my example appears to be at least the incorporation of an early 18th century blade onto a later hilt. However, I think much comparison stops there, at least as far as the ad-hoc nature is concerned. For the shape of the hilt itself, I have never seen anything like it. The usage of bars alone seems very unusual, most Highland basket hilts always seemed to have some sort of joinwork, and the basket pieces seem to be more flat and rectangular. A few unusual examples of 'cage hilts' on broadswords and rapiers in the early modern era, but nothing quite like this.

Additionally, the bars appear, at least on the outside of the guard, to be interlocked in such a way as to provide reinforcement to each other, although that might also be assuming a better heat treat? Floral elements where they all converge into 1 point to join at the pommel is something less associated with the more 270 degree protection of a basket hilt which comes at the cost of less wrist articulation, and it was earlier styles of guard which had the tradeoff down at the bottom of the hand. Pommel itself appears to have some nice hand embossed designs, and the grip is of the style mentioned by Mr. Jim McDougall here as a "round tang espada."

The blade is likely German given the inscription, I was unable to make a satisfactory translation of the final word myself at least using the photos alone. Nothing unusual in my opinion, single edged back or broadsword blade that then shapes into what looks like the flattened hexagonal shape you see very common in the early modern era, or more lenticular though I do not think the semantics here are too important with regards to its functionality.

The rivets on each of the bars joining them to the main portion of the hilt are unmistakably the flaming bomb motif used by fusiliers and grenadiers. That alone does not tell me much given how widely used that symbol is to the point I could make a non serious claim it is from the Springfield Armoury in Massachusetts.

However, I find myself completely stumped on it. The form appears to be bespoke and deliberate, not an existing modification. The usage of flaming bombs by choice may signal a military or colonial provenance, although I have not seen anything similar in appearance. The grip however is of the more composite style. If I may make an arbitrary guess, I might estimate closer to the Napoleonic Wars as far as hilt manufacture.

As a final note, the listing does give at least one point of provenance with the book listed. While I am waiting to acquire a copy, if anyone were to have an extant version and finds anything they feel is insightful, please feel free to let me know. I am unaware of any specific Spanish or Mexican or other North, Central, and South American-related state with a basket hilted grenadier sword and I would value any insight from this forum.

Thank you!

[Jim McDougall]

This is a most unusual example of officers sword which indeed does appear to be likely of French origin, but hard to define without comprehensive references on the swords of the Napoleonic period. The inscription does suggest the sort of inscription often occurring on Mexican swords of the 19th century in this case with what appears commemorative date 1720.

Mexican officers from the time of Santa Anna, were highly influenced by French military and Santa Anna himself was a great admirer of Napoleon. The spectrum of Mexican swords recorded in references is less than comprehensive as well. Without comparative examples on this, I would suggest it may well be to a Mexican officer of mid 19th c. possibly earlier.

The quillon arrangement in the guard here illustrates the influence on locally made Mexican swords of the Revolution of 1810 and later, with multi branch guards, often four rather than the three of regular cavalry hilts.

The illustrations are a French artillery officers sword c.1800 with flaming bomb on guard. The more elaborate neoclassic hilt on the example posted here is with the kind of baroque neo classic decoration much favored by the French , on this multibranch guard.
The obviously crudely made Mexican example shown is c.1810-20s reflects the influence of these more elaborate French hilts.
The blade on the posted example resembles blades of French cuirassiers forms of Napoleonic period, but would have French markings.
There were sword makers in Mexico, Oaxaca, who produced swords well through the 19th c.

I have never seen the flaming bomb used in Mexican sword designs but may well derive from the strong French influence. Understandable reference to the Springfield arsenal who used this device during WWI on the M1913 Patton sword as well as other 'ordnance' materials.


I cannot pull up the thread listed.

A further note on this blade, the deeply channeled double fuller on the model ANXI cuirassiers sword of First Empire used 1804-1816 ran the full blade length.
It does seen quite possible this might, as suggested, be a German version and perhaps during the Confederation of the Rhine 1806-1813 when Solingen was impacted by French control under Napoleon. He was having ANXI swords produced in Milan as well so I wonder if this might be a possibility when he took over North Italy in 1805 until he annexed to Austro-Hungary in 1814?
While I am no linguist, the phrase on the blade though Latin in the manner of the familiar 'Spanish motto' seems to have an Italian ring to it, 'ME SENAL ES EL CAVISCO= my sign is the 'cavisco' (what does cavisco mean?).
DEL VOY=of I go? ENALEMANIA SOLICE ANO 1720= refuge in Germany in 1720?

I found the book referenced and anxious for it to arrive. Definitely a mystery in the character and nationality of this sword overall. I hope someone else will take interest here as well, and that the original poster will return.

[midelburgo]

Hi.
We have found that cavisco before.
It is actually to mean,
MI SEÑAL ES EL CABEZO DE REY, my mark is a kings head. Of course a typical Solingen mark for centuries.
I am watching the pictures at a phone, so I can be very mistaken, but my ideas are.

Non regulation sword ordered by somebody in Germany. The hilt remembers me of police swords. The blade I believe, is a XIX century copy of a XVIII c blade.
Including bad spelled motto.

[Jim McDougall]

Thank you for coming in on this! You are probably the best informed on Spanish national and colonial weapons, so your insights are most important.
I had not thought of transliteration with that word cavisco, and your idea sounds logical as the context of the sentence- 'my sign is' would go to the 'head' (of the king) of course. It seems odd to spell it out rather than just use an interpretation of the mark.

The hilt seems of course 19th c. as you note, and the blade, again as you note similar to the French cuirassiers ANXI, but fullering not entirely the same.
I cannot figure out the 'solice' and ano 1720. Obviously EN ALEMANIA refers to Germany so that attribution in accord with that production.

The flaming bomb? seen on French weapons of course as noted, but I am not aware of such symbol on Spanish swords......have you?

Thank you again!
All the best
Jim

[Hotspur]

Mounted, or infantry grenadier? The theme comes up a lot in the lowlands, UK and Iberia. The grip and basket a bit Spanish in my mind.

Here is a neat hanger and an American eagle in British guise, with a knuckle bow. Dmitry had one.

Cheers
GC

[Jim McDougall]

Thanks Glen, that makes sense. Through the 'laws of diffusion', since the French were Bourbons, as was the royal house in Spain it seems plausible to have been present on some weapons' motif.

With Great Britain and the Holland, there were of course strong ties as well, and often weapon forms and motif became transcendent.

[midelburgo]

The grenade is a simbol for the French Gendarmerie too.

After making some searches I am unable to find the CAVISCO DEL VOI=CABEZO DEL REI discussion. Maybe it took place in swordforum and not in vkingsword.

I believe Bonham made the Spanish colonial conection because they previously had this sword:

https://www.bonhams.com/auction/3091...fficers-sword/

[Magey_McMage]

Apologies for the late reply, the sword has been in transit and I figured there was no point in making multiple posts if it can be avoided. Will attempt to take acceptable photos later but a quick update first:

As above, it has arrived. I would congratulate Bonhams on using a deceptively fine camera lens. Photos appear as if the guard is quite large. That is not the case whatsoever. The guard is extremely form fitting, like a British Scots field officer's sword (a bit of foreshadowing). It is of a non ferrous metal, so their description of a 'silver' hilt may actually be true.

The nut at the top, almost like an old top as in the toy, is threaded. I was able to unscrew it with absolute ease. The bow of the guard is secured a la most sabres to the pommel cap underneath. Whatever metal the guard is made out of has mild flex but I'm not going to do anything severe enough to attempt to fully disassemble it. However, I would guess that the knucklebow, like a Wilkinson, is already secured to the blade, perhaps by a 2nd hidden nut? The pommel cap is set somewhat asymmetrically to fit on the grip and tang. What this means I cannot say but when looking perpendicularly down at the pommel, the center is off by a few mm. Perhaps a way of taking a curved tang off center and doing what you can?

The stats are as follows, from a rough bed estimate:
-Weight == ~775grams, give or take some due to the extreme length and balance
-Blade length == ~85cm, but with a rounded tip that looks quite weathered it may easily have been 86cm back in the day
-Width/thickness == 30mm wide which seems to be exactly where I would assume, but only about 7-8mm thick. I suppose this is consistent with earlier blades, however it may have been a bit wider as heavy grinding marks are observed on the ricasso and the spine.
-Both the spine and the ricasso are angled to form narrow slightly undulating ridges. As this is outside of my general area and god knows I cant afford early 18 or before at this point, I will photograph it later and leave discussion to you all.

I was unable to find any markings whatsoever. Over the ~300 years since the blade was made, it appears to have gone from a flattened hexagonal-to-lenticular profile into a more lentincular one. The engraving is the same on both sides, and you can faintly see those period-appropriate decorations below the fullers. I cannot fully make out the engravings myself but I trust what has already been posted, perhaps combining both sides will make it easier?

As I said above, the hilt is much smaller than photos made it out to be. Fortunately, what I perceived as a round bulbous thing meant only to be hammer gripped is actually quite pleasant in the hand. No curve, but closer to the french 1845/55. Feels quite nice and one can index their thumb on the back nicely. I cannot execute a fully extended Radaelli type grip, but it feels better than most 'spadroon' grips that the north and western Europeans used at this time.

How it feels in the hand? I had initially thought that this was a broadsword, quite literally, based on the images. However, when moving the sword around, it feels closer to what I would consider a shearing sword or thrust-centric backsword. The foible has flex, but is still quite sharp. POB is not far enough down the blade nor is it wide enough to be a hugely effective cutter, although wrist-articulated actions would at least do serious damage to any unarmoured limbs. The spine stays thick or at least flat-ter than the front only to the edge of the double fullered engraved forte, upon which it becomes as sharp as the front. Maybe not a truly symmetric double edged sword, but let's call it 87.5% of the way there?

If you've ever handled a Scots Field officer's sword before, or even the French superior officer's sword, this feels extremely similar. Quite similar to a Spanish-influenced Neapolitan sword I have and wrote about on the SBG forum and is my favorite non-sabre sword of this era even. Like that, there is a certain liveliness to it. Similar to a spadroon but my primary issue with at least the British/German/Swedish styles is those grips are so narrow, with vestigial finger rings, that even if you wanted to cut it is all but impossible to hold them nicely. That is not the case here. It is not optimized for thrusting in that there is anywhere to pinch or finger the guard, but it is a much more neutrally designed grip you can hammer or handshake with equal success.

Whatever the Grenades are made of is the same material as the bars of the guard. The grip was once lacquered as evidenced by remains of black intermittently. Silver wire twist in the grooves. Blade is a bit bent and I may attempt to alleviate that later. A more post-Napoleonic black leather washer a la the French sits at the ricasso. Very thin and a bit rubbery, I have not yet attempted to remove it to see what is underneath but it is <1mm so there are no markings. The shape of the main guard does remind me of this sword here: https://sallyantiques.co.uk/product/...-hilted-sword/ (Please let me know if this should be removed, it has already sold, I am only posting it for reference), with a similar curve of the tail, the boat shaped main section, and the way the bars of the guard extend from it.

Any possible provenance that is mine to guess would probably be a senior officer either mounted or dismounted, but leading a non-mounted unit given it is not as robust as most cavalry sabres are, but that is based solely on my experience with British and French superior officer sabres, which are quite lovely things. Ironic to lock away a very well balanced svelte thrust-and-cut sword behind a rank at which you are unlikely to ever use it.

All of that to say I still have no damned idea what it is. I've gone through all 77 pages of prior threads to open everything I find interesting and am still working my way through those. I am fully open to the idea of it being French or anything else. However, I was under the impression that this specific type of grip and pommel cap was for the Spanish, Mexican, colonial, post Colonial, etc. sphere of Latin America, and I would be curious to see other designs. I buy swords as mechanical pieces of history though, not for the story, so it ultimately matters not where it originated from, only that I can find an answer.

I will attempt to take photos later tonight and do more precise markings. Because the tang is threaded (which I'd frankly date to no earlier than the 2nd quarter of the 19th century IE 1825-1850), the sword is in quite solid condition. A bit of play wrt the pommel cap and the shrunken horn grip, but the remains of the lacquer could also be former leather that has worn and caused the rattle as well.

Profuse apologies for rambling for so long, I simply wanted to make sure I covered every point I could think of. If there are any requests for photos, please let me know. I will probably take some comparing it to various British and French and Spanish/Neapolitan swords I own as well. Thank you!