Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Identification of markings on 16th century German arquebus

Matchlock · 18th April 2012, 02:46 PM

Hi Jean-Marc,

This is the coat-of-arms of the Grafen (counts) von Giech, Schloss Thurnau, Franconia, Germany, and the Freiherren von Könitz.
It must be branded in the butt stock of a matchlock musket - not an arquebus - that cannot date from the 16th century but must have been made during the first half of the 17th century, The Thirty Years War.
It represents the allied coats-of-arms of the Giech and Könitz families, and the inscription initials stand for 'Carl Gottfried (vnd) Dorothea von Giech (the G repeated) vnd Könitz', following their marriage in 1633.

I am afraid I can, even by those poor images, identify the piece. It was offered by Bolk and was a crudely cut-down and composite musket fragment - at best. The serpentine did not belong either. You can tell by the mismatching proportions - the butt stock is way too long for the rest of the piece - that the gun was severely cut down and the barrel does not belong. The images attached.

What's even more, the complete armory of the Counts of Giech was sold by Sotheby's in two sales in 1974. The catalogs together with a complete documentation are in in my library. This gun was not included in the sales as it never existed before the way it looks now!

In order to demonstrate what an original Giech musket looks like I attach photos of the piece in my collection, from part II of the sale, 19 Nov 1974, lot 268 (misprinted as lot 266 in the catalog), the catalog photo depicting my piece (on top) together with another similar from the same series. Please note that the barrels and locks of all genuine (!) Giech muskets were SVL marked!

The color photos at the bottom show my Giech musket, lot 268, overall length 172 cm, the stock of characteristic shape (!) and stained brown, the forestock with no provision for a ramrod (!) and mounted with a small hook.

That's exactly what all original Giech muskets branded with that coat-of-arms looked like. Now compare the Bolk piece ...

The Giech and Könitz coats-of-arms attached at the end.

Sorry, and best,
Michael

18th April 2012, 02:46 PM	#3
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Hi Jean-Marc, This is the coat-of-arms of the Grafen (counts) von Giech, Schloss Thurnau, Franconia, Germany, and the Freiherren von Könitz. It must be branded in the butt stock of a matchlock musket - not an arquebus - that cannot date from the 16th century but must have been made during the first half of the 17th century, The Thirty Years War. It represents the allied coats-of-arms of the Giech and Könitz families, and the inscription initials stand for 'Carl Gottfried (vnd) Dorothea von Giech (the G repeated) vnd Könitz', following their marriage in 1633. I am afraid I can, even by those poor images, identify the piece. It was offered by Bolk and was a crudely cut-down and composite musket fragment - at best. The serpentine did not belong either. You can tell by the mismatching proportions - the butt stock is way too long for the rest of the piece - that the gun was severely cut down and the barrel does not belong. The images attached. What's even more, the complete armory of the Counts of Giech was sold by Sotheby's in two sales in 1974. The catalogs together with a complete documentation are in in my library. This gun was not included in the sales as it never existed before the way it looks now! In order to demonstrate what an original Giech musket looks like I attach photos of the piece in my collection, from part II of the sale, 19 Nov 1974, lot 268 (misprinted as lot 266 in the catalog), the catalog photo depicting my piece (on top) together with another similar from the same series. Please note that the barrels and locks of all genuine (!) Giech muskets were SVL marked! The color photos at the bottom show my Giech musket, lot 268, overall length 172 cm, the stock of characteristic shape (!) and stained brown, the forestock with no provision for a ramrod (!) and mounted with a small hook. That's exactly what all original Giech muskets branded with that coat-of-arms looked like. Now compare the Bolk piece ... The Giech and Könitz coats-of-arms attached at the end. Sorry, and best, Michael Attached Images Last edited by Matchlock; 18th April 2012 at 09:03 PM.