Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Jim McDougall · 3rd December 2023, 06:32 PM

Swordlover, there you have the exact scenario discussed, clearly this is of the French blade 'fourbusiers' (cutlers) and the various magic and military panoply based themes that have become collectively termed in many references as 'Caissagnard'. As earlier noted, he was one of such cutlers who was situated in Nantes, which seems to have been a hotbed of these type of blade motif's.

In a previous discussion we have discussed the esoteric 'rose' marking on the spine of blades at the forte which seems to be agreed to be a Solingen affectation on blades with similar decorative motif. As with many of these themes, it appears that much of the influence derived from Eastern Europe and the 'hussar' phenomenon which captivated most of Europe in the mid to late 18thc.
Along with the 'oriental' mystique of the light cavalry 'hussars' which of course included the 'pandour' units, was the attraction to oriental fashion and weapons (mostly Ottoman and the yatahans for example). Along with this came the mysterious 'magic' sigils and devices which seem to have been contrived from all manner of unusual sources.

Among these were characters of the alphabets of Glagolitic; Bosnian Cyrillic; Caballistic symbols; and numbers of others incuding alchemical and astrologic symbols, all variously assembled in coded interpretations.

These 'magic' symbols were seen to have talismanic properties (as with amulets from Passau known as Passau art, the famed running wolf one of them).

Many of these devices are almost wildly contrived, and seen as invocations to summon angels ( there was even an alphabet called Enochian) in keeping with remarkably superstitious beliefs of these times.

In looking at this, it is tempting to see the 'rose' symbols on the Solingen blades as part of this 'magical' motif phenomenon of mid to late 18th into early 19th c.
The Prince of Wales in late 1790s ordered a number of 'oriental' style blades (with yelman point) and talismanic motif for sabers for his officers from Solingen.

The cosmological basis in much of this symbolism derive from the sun and moon (which are depicted in an almost 'Tarot' style artistry) which are symbols of the Szekely, the ethnic sub group of Hungary from ancient times. The Hungarian nation of course has notable influence on blade decoration of these kinds in these times.

3rd December 2023, 06:32 PM	#22
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,782	Swordlover, there you have the exact scenario discussed, clearly this is of the French blade 'fourbusiers' (cutlers) and the various magic and military panoply based themes that have become collectively termed in many references as 'Caissagnard'. As earlier noted, he was one of such cutlers who was situated in Nantes, which seems to have been a hotbed of these type of blade motif's. In a previous discussion we have discussed the esoteric 'rose' marking on the spine of blades at the forte which seems to be agreed to be a Solingen affectation on blades with similar decorative motif. As with many of these themes, it appears that much of the influence derived from Eastern Europe and the 'hussar' phenomenon which captivated most of Europe in the mid to late 18thc. Along with the 'oriental' mystique of the light cavalry 'hussars' which of course included the 'pandour' units, was the attraction to oriental fashion and weapons (mostly Ottoman and the yatahans for example). Along with this came the mysterious 'magic' sigils and devices which seem to have been contrived from all manner of unusual sources. Among these were characters of the alphabets of Glagolitic; Bosnian Cyrillic; Caballistic symbols; and numbers of others incuding alchemical and astrologic symbols, all variously assembled in coded interpretations. These 'magic' symbols were seen to have talismanic properties (as with amulets from Passau known as Passau art, the famed running wolf one of them). Many of these devices are almost wildly contrived, and seen as invocations to summon angels ( there was even an alphabet called Enochian) in keeping with remarkably superstitious beliefs of these times. In looking at this, it is tempting to see the 'rose' symbols on the Solingen blades as part of this 'magical' motif phenomenon of mid to late 18th into early 19th c. The Prince of Wales in late 1790s ordered a number of 'oriental' style blades (with yelman point) and talismanic motif for sabers for his officers from Solingen. The cosmological basis in much of this symbolism derive from the sun and moon (which are depicted in an almost 'Tarot' style artistry) which are symbols of the Szekely, the ethnic sub group of Hungary from ancient times. The Hungarian nation of course has notable influence on blade decoration of these kinds in these times. Last edited by Jim McDougall; 3rd December 2023 at 06:54 PM.