Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Pusaka · 13th November 2005, 01:30 PM

Ok I think I now understand the problem. Old keris are made with Iron with or without pamor but new keris are made with steel with or without pamor. The difference between Iron and steel is that steel has carbon added which strengthens the blade however it also increases the rate of rusting. Steel will rust much faster then Iron. The rate at which a material will rust will also affect the ability of the blade to keep an edge.
An example of this is when you shave you will notice that the razor blade gets blunt after about 2 or 3 shaves. It’s not your stubble which has caused the blade to get blunt but it’s the oxidisation (rusting) at the blade edge which causes it to become blunt and brittle, this is the major factor which causes razors to become blunt.
As I said before Iron rusts slower then steel so an Iron blade will keep its edge longer then a steel blade. The down side of this is that Iron is brittle and prone to fracturing whilst steel is not. If you were to put an old keris blade in a vice and apply pressure across the blade face it will simply snap because its made from Iron. If however you did the same to a modern keris blade it would flex and bend more before breaking because it’s made from steel.
The fact that keris blades were regularly oiled obviously would also protect it from rusting and thus help to keep the blade sharp.
Its only now that I realise that rate of rusting is the major factor in the ability of a blade to keep its edge that I realise why old keris tend to be sharper then steel keris.
The modern solution to this would be to make the blade from rust resistant steel so you would get the best of both worlds, the flexibility and strength of steel but a better blade edge then an Iron (old) keris.

Marto Suwigny your post was very informative and you established that there is such thing as black Iron and different grades of colours of Irons. I am guessing that the colour variation is caused by the presence of other minerals in the Iron ore, is that a good thing or a bad thing i.e. is pure Iron better?

13th November 2005, 01:30 PM	#14
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	Ok I think I now understand the problem. Old keris are made with Iron with or without pamor but new keris are made with steel with or without pamor. The difference between Iron and steel is that steel has carbon added which strengthens the blade however it also increases the rate of rusting. Steel will rust much faster then Iron. The rate at which a material will rust will also affect the ability of the blade to keep an edge. An example of this is when you shave you will notice that the razor blade gets blunt after about 2 or 3 shaves. It’s not your stubble which has caused the blade to get blunt but it’s the oxidisation (rusting) at the blade edge which causes it to become blunt and brittle, this is the major factor which causes razors to become blunt. As I said before Iron rusts slower then steel so an Iron blade will keep its edge longer then a steel blade. The down side of this is that Iron is brittle and prone to fracturing whilst steel is not. If you were to put an old keris blade in a vice and apply pressure across the blade face it will simply snap because its made from Iron. If however you did the same to a modern keris blade it would flex and bend more before breaking because it’s made from steel. The fact that keris blades were regularly oiled obviously would also protect it from rusting and thus help to keep the blade sharp. Its only now that I realise that rate of rusting is the major factor in the ability of a blade to keep its edge that I realise why old keris tend to be sharper then steel keris. The modern solution to this would be to make the blade from rust resistant steel so you would get the best of both worlds, the flexibility and strength of steel but a better blade edge then an Iron (old) keris. Marto Suwigny your post was very informative and you established that there is such thing as black Iron and different grades of colours of Irons. I am guessing that the colour variation is caused by the presence of other minerals in the Iron ore, is that a good thing or a bad thing i.e. is pure Iron better? Last edited by Pusaka; 13th November 2005 at 01:49 PM.