Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Jim McDougall · 7th August 2021, 08:14 PM

This has indeed been a fascinating discussion, and as always a total learning experience.
It has been for me more of a 'by the numbers' probe into examination of an example from photos alone, so my observations are admittedly rather arbitrary as derived from resources available.

I first began to learn about shashkas in around 1993, and through Oliver Pinchot, who honestly knew more about them than I could imagine, and most of it from first hand knowledge through many connections in these and associated regions. Though being disappointed in the outcome, I would not by any means dispute his assessment.

I.P. in your post #13, you note the pre 1896 suggestion I made, which I meant to be toward these fixtures in the mounts. It would seem surprising that the silver hallmark would be spuriously applied. Very good note on the chemical anomalies which occur in silver as well.

This blade is as agreed an older blade with the running wolf grouping more recently applied.
I had not noticed the reverse carry on the Russian swords, and I do not have 'Mollo' handy, but if I recall, the reverse carry was adopted by mounted troops after the Caucasian fashion in the Cossack units. This was I think also put into use in the line units.
In the one sword in the drawings the scabbard mounts show the cross type apertures to place the Moison-Nagant socket bayonet from the 1891 rifles.
This would suggest infantry if not mistaken.

Eduard Wagner, the artist and author of the book "Cut & Thrust Weapons" from which this is derived, was not one for 'artistic license', in fact his penchant for detail was beyond reproach in my opinion. So I would think this interpretation on the carry mounts is correct.

At this point I am still unclear on the definition of skan, and still puzzled at the grip and decorative elements in the mounts material.

I would also appreciate a more objective description of 'Circassian' style. It seems that the Circassian groups were thoroughly dispersed over much of the western Caucusus transcending regional borders.

7th August 2021, 08:14 PM	#16
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,770	This has indeed been a fascinating discussion, and as always a total learning experience. It has been for me more of a 'by the numbers' probe into examination of an example from photos alone, so my observations are admittedly rather arbitrary as derived from resources available. I first began to learn about shashkas in around 1993, and through Oliver Pinchot, who honestly knew more about them than I could imagine, and most of it from first hand knowledge through many connections in these and associated regions. Though being disappointed in the outcome, I would not by any means dispute his assessment. I.P. in your post #13, you note the pre 1896 suggestion I made, which I meant to be toward these fixtures in the mounts. It would seem surprising that the silver hallmark would be spuriously applied. Very good note on the chemical anomalies which occur in silver as well. This blade is as agreed an older blade with the running wolf grouping more recently applied. I had not noticed the reverse carry on the Russian swords, and I do not have 'Mollo' handy, but if I recall, the reverse carry was adopted by mounted troops after the Caucasian fashion in the Cossack units. This was I think also put into use in the line units. In the one sword in the drawings the scabbard mounts show the cross type apertures to place the Moison-Nagant socket bayonet from the 1891 rifles. This would suggest infantry if not mistaken. Eduard Wagner, the artist and author of the book "Cut & Thrust Weapons" from which this is derived, was not one for 'artistic license', in fact his penchant for detail was beyond reproach in my opinion. So I would think this interpretation on the carry mounts is correct. At this point I am still unclear on the definition of skan, and still puzzled at the grip and decorative elements in the mounts material. I would also appreciate a more objective description of 'Circassian' style. It seems that the Circassian groups were thoroughly dispersed over much of the western Caucusus transcending regional borders.