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David · 25th July 2022, 11:07 PM

Interesting conversations so far.
At this point i would just like to interject that the concept of the seen and unseen worlds is not isolated to a relatively small area in South East Asia. It is a universal concept. The names change, and certain entities can be specific to various locations, but the concepts remain the same. It's just another example of the "Name Game". Perhaps the reason that many Westerners have difficulty grasping these concepts is because of the intense indoctrination of Abrahamic religions, specifically Christianity, in Western cultures. In the United States, where i grew up, Christianity became so dominate that many people have come to believe we were always an intentional Christian nation. Anything outside those beliefs were to be considered foreign and shunned. Though a deeper investigation of these Abrahamic religions can still find a mystical current that lies beneath. It has simply been surpassed for centuries as a means to control the population. I have spent many years investigating and studying various pagan currents such Wicca and traditional Western witchcraft as well as diving deeply into the ceremonial lodge magick that arose in Europe in the 18th-19th centuries. And through my interest in drumming i have studied quite a bit about Haitian Vodoun and the African diaspora practices where i have found some remarkable parallels there to the beliefs to be found in various Indonesian cultures. Again, these concepts are universal. We are one human species living on our one and only planet. The spirits change names, many are may be specific to the exacting environments where people have interacted with them, but ultimately it is all one and the same.
This is all to say that despite what i have heard some people say, i do not believe that one must be raised in Indonesia or spend a great deal of time there to grasp these concepts of the seen and unseen world. This "magick" exists all around the world if we open ourselves up to it and though the specifics may vary the basic operations are pretty much the same. To use a computer analogy, the software changes, but the hard drive remains the same.

25th July 2022, 11:07 PM	#15
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	Interesting conversations so far. At this point i would just like to interject that the concept of the seen and unseen worlds is not isolated to a relatively small area in South East Asia. It is a universal concept. The names change, and certain entities can be specific to various locations, but the concepts remain the same. It's just another example of the "Name Game". Perhaps the reason that many Westerners have difficulty grasping these concepts is because of the intense indoctrination of Abrahamic religions, specifically Christianity, in Western cultures. In the United States, where i grew up, Christianity became so dominate that many people have come to believe we were always an intentional Christian nation. Anything outside those beliefs were to be considered foreign and shunned. Though a deeper investigation of these Abrahamic religions can still find a mystical current that lies beneath. It has simply been surpassed for centuries as a means to control the population. I have spent many years investigating and studying various pagan currents such Wicca and traditional Western witchcraft as well as diving deeply into the ceremonial lodge magick that arose in Europe in the 18th-19th centuries. And through my interest in drumming i have studied quite a bit about Haitian Vodoun and the African diaspora practices where i have found some remarkable parallels there to the beliefs to be found in various Indonesian cultures. Again, these concepts are universal. We are one human species living on our one and only planet. The spirits change names, many are may be specific to the exacting environments where people have interacted with them, but ultimately it is all one and the same. This is all to say that despite what i have heard some people say, i do not believe that one must be raised in Indonesia or spend a great deal of time there to grasp these concepts of the seen and unseen world. This "magick" exists all around the world if we open ourselves up to it and though the specifics may vary the basic operations are pretty much the same. To use a computer analogy, the software changes, but the hard drive remains the same.