Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - The EARLY MAKERS TRADE MARKS thread... lost and partly restored.

fernando · 19th October 2017, 03:12 PM

Old 27th May 2012, 07:05 PM #234

Posted by:
Jim McDougall
EAA Research Consultant

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66

Outstanding entries Ibrahiim! especially Marc's work on the metallurgy of many of these blades. The presence of Muslim swordsmiths in Spain is well established in medieval times and of course the jineta weapons as well. The diffusion between the processes and techniques between them and the Frankish smiths is also well known.
While there may be a degree of connection developmentally it is not as far as I know clearly defined other than obvious influences being exchanged.
The power of Solingens ever increasing production by the 17th and 18th century had superceded that of Toledo and blades were produced for the markets of Spain and Portugal as well as so many others.

Although these blades were characteristically marked with inscriptions, names and marks to appeal to these markets, I am not sure of any Islamic mark or inscription of earlier Spanish makers of those earlier periods which might have carried forth into this later context.

It is known however, that many earlier heroic and romanticized notions from European and perhaps even earlier Frankish period/Viking periods were often included on blades along with these otherwise 'tailored' markings.

Having noted that, in further consideration of the 'wavy' blade idea to allude to fabled swords in chivalry, I completely forgot about Lee Jones important work on medieval blades "The Serpent in the Sword" . In this discussion on metallurgy of early medieval blades, he notes the cite from Paul DuChaillu (1889, "The Viking Age") where Skeggi instructs Kormak on the use of his sword Skofnung; "...if thou comest to the fighting place, sit alone and draw it. Hold up the blade and blow on it, then a small snake will creep from under the guard". These words metaphorically are meant to remind him to respect the sword and control his impulsiveness.

Perhaps this perception seen inlaid on medieval blades such as shown by Jasper of the 13th c. example may have been carried forth in marks used along with others which survived as well, such as the crosses, cross and orb and others. Again admittedly speculative, but worthy of consideration.
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19th October 2017, 03:12 PM	#205
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,642	Old 27th May 2012, 07:05 PM #234 Posted by: Jim McDougall EAA Research Consultant Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Outstanding entries Ibrahiim! especially Marc's work on the metallurgy of many of these blades. The presence of Muslim swordsmiths in Spain is well established in medieval times and of course the jineta weapons as well. The diffusion between the processes and techniques between them and the Frankish smiths is also well known. While there may be a degree of connection developmentally it is not as far as I know clearly defined other than obvious influences being exchanged. The power of Solingens ever increasing production by the 17th and 18th century had superceded that of Toledo and blades were produced for the markets of Spain and Portugal as well as so many others. Although these blades were characteristically marked with inscriptions, names and marks to appeal to these markets, I am not sure of any Islamic mark or inscription of earlier Spanish makers of those earlier periods which might have carried forth into this later context. It is known however, that many earlier heroic and romanticized notions from European and perhaps even earlier Frankish period/Viking periods were often included on blades along with these otherwise 'tailored' markings. Having noted that, in further consideration of the 'wavy' blade idea to allude to fabled swords in chivalry, I completely forgot about Lee Jones important work on medieval blades "The Serpent in the Sword" . In this discussion on metallurgy of early medieval blades, he notes the cite from Paul DuChaillu (1889, "The Viking Age") where Skeggi instructs Kormak on the use of his sword Skofnung; "...if thou comest to the fighting place, sit alone and draw it. Hold up the blade and blow on it, then a small snake will creep from under the guard". These words metaphorically are meant to remind him to respect the sword and control his impulsiveness. Perhaps this perception seen inlaid on medieval blades such as shown by Jasper of the 13th c. example may have been carried forth in marks used along with others which survived as well, such as the crosses, cross and orb and others. Again admittedly speculative, but worthy of consideration. . Last edited by fernando; 20th October 2017 at 03:37 PM.