Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Matchlock · 24th February 2014, 05:04 PM

Hi Raf,

I must say that I have my severe doubts as to the authenticity of this matchlock musket.
It is definitley not Dutch as its general shape denotes but German, either Suhl or Zella made. The sample that Jasper posted can be dated ca. 1620 and must be of greater length, ca. 156-160 cm, and so are all the other muskets in his post. They have nothing to do with our piece in discussion.

First of all, the overall shape of the gun - the form of the buttstock, barrel and lock, disregarding the stock decoration - suggest that this is a characteristic German military matchlock musket of ca. 1645-50. Many specimen of this perculiar type are known in both public and private collections, and the octagonal breech of the barrel usually is struck with maker's marks and the town marks of either Suhl or Zella, both Thuringian centers of 17th c. firearms mass production.
Representing the latest French style that was a guide line in that period, the barrel shows a short 16-sided stage in between the octagonal breech and the round forward section.
The trigger gurad on your gun is missing, and the grip of the pan cover is writhen in a way that denotes that it is a later addition. All the pan covers of that type were identical in shape, please refer to the attachments in detail.
Could we see the barrel marks, please?

The overall length of the gun should be ca. 1,40 m.

Now comes the tricky point: the beechwood full stock shows a profuse inlay work comprising materials such as bone and mother-of-pearl that would be characteristic of Dresden muskets of the Trabanten-Leibgarde of the Elector Christian I of Saxony, which means 1580's! Of course, these guns really looked archaic, with their great overall length of 156 cm and their long tiller triggers that were employed without trigger guards.

Thus we face a temporary discrepancy that cannot be easily solved. I do not know of one single instance that would prove that that kind of late-16th c. stock decoration was used almost without any stylistic alterations in the mid-17th century.

Poland however is known to have 'embellished' a great number of originally plain German and Austrian military guns in ca. the 1680's to ca. 1700 but in a completely obsolete style of ca. 1600. This one could be such a Polish-embellished gun.

Attached on top please find a number of typical plain matchlock muskets of this Zella/Suhl manufactured 1640's type:

- in my collection (with Zella marks), coming from the former Blell/Zeulenroda colln., the barrel and lock struck with Zella marks

- a group of 8 of these muskets preserved in the Musée de l'Armée, Paris, all with Zella marks (author's photos, 1994)

- Dorotheum Vienna, 29 Febr thru 3rd March 1912

Following a few samples of 1580's Saxon (Dresden) matchlock muskets with highly decorated stocks.

Best,
Michael

24th February 2014, 05:04 PM	#3
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Hi Raf, I must say that I have my severe doubts as to the authenticity of this matchlock musket. It is definitley not Dutch as its general shape denotes but German, either Suhl or Zella made. The sample that Jasper posted can be dated ca. 1620 and must be of greater length, ca. 156-160 cm, and so are all the other muskets in his post. They have nothing to do with our piece in discussion. First of all, the overall shape of the gun - the form of the buttstock, barrel and lock, disregarding the stock decoration - suggest that this is a characteristic German military matchlock musket of ca. 1645-50. Many specimen of this perculiar type are known in both public and private collections, and the octagonal breech of the barrel usually is struck with maker's marks and the town marks of either Suhl or Zella, both Thuringian centers of 17th c. firearms mass production. Representing the latest French style that was a guide line in that period, the barrel shows a short 16-sided stage in between the octagonal breech and the round forward section. The trigger gurad on your gun is missing, and the grip of the pan cover is writhen in a way that denotes that it is a later addition. All the pan covers of that type were identical in shape, please refer to the attachments in detail. Could we see the barrel marks, please? The overall length of the gun should be ca. 1,40 m. Now comes the tricky point: the beechwood full stock shows a profuse inlay work comprising materials such as bone and mother-of-pearl that would be characteristic of Dresden muskets of the Trabanten-Leibgarde of the Elector Christian I of Saxony, which means 1580's! Of course, these guns really looked archaic, with their great overall length of 156 cm and their long tiller triggers that were employed without trigger guards. Thus we face a temporary discrepancy that cannot be easily solved. I do not know of one single instance that would prove that that kind of late-16th c. stock decoration was used almost without any stylistic alterations in the mid-17th century. Poland however is known to have 'embellished' a great number of originally plain German and Austrian military guns in ca. the 1680's to ca. 1700 but in a completely obsolete style of ca. 1600. This one could be such a Polish-embellished gun. Attached on top please find a number of typical plain matchlock muskets of this Zella/Suhl manufactured 1640's type: - in my collection (with Zella marks), coming from the former Blell/Zeulenroda colln., the barrel and lock struck with Zella marks - a group of 8 of these muskets preserved in the Musée de l'Armée, Paris, all with Zella marks (author's photos, 1994) - Dorotheum Vienna, 29 Febr thru 3rd March 1912 Following a few samples of 1580's Saxon (Dresden) matchlock muskets with highly decorated stocks. Best, Michael Attached Images Last edited by Matchlock; 24th February 2014 at 07:25 PM.