Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Ian · 5th May 2005, 06:21 AM

Obviously we have two different swords here.

Jens picture shows an Indo-Persian (tulwar) hilted sword with recurved blade and T-spine. The blade resembles a yataghan, but as Rob has noted it is probably a sossun patah of Islamic form (versus Hindu form). We have seen T-spined yataghan before, I think with Ottoman hilts, but I don't recall one with a tulwar hilt. I agree with Rob that the T-spine suggests the NW Frontier region: Afghanistan or nearby. The scabbard seems unusual also in that the suspension system is two rings mounted at the throat of the scabbard, similar to Moroccan swords and knives. I'm out of my depth trying to expain the origin of that feature.

Rick's sword, as noted by Rob, resembles a kirach, with a pointed downcurved blade. Again the large false edge and partial T-spine seem unusual, and might suggest NW India. What strikes me as most obviously uncommon on this one is the hilt -- a hybrid between the Indian basket hilt and the Indo-Persian (tulwar) hilt. We saw a couple of pictures illustrating this transitional form of hilt at Timonium, and I think they were attributed to a particular period, as the fashion shifted from the older Indian basket form to the tulwar form, but again I don't recall the exact time frame. I was sitting next to Jim McDougall who was taking copious notes,

so I'm sure Jim will be contributing here shortly.

Ian.

5th May 2005, 06:21 AM	#3
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,034	Obviously we have two different swords here. Jens picture shows an Indo-Persian (tulwar) hilted sword with recurved blade and T-spine. The blade resembles a yataghan, but as Rob has noted it is probably a sossun patah of Islamic form (versus Hindu form). We have seen T-spined yataghan before, I think with Ottoman hilts, but I don't recall one with a tulwar hilt. I agree with Rob that the T-spine suggests the NW Frontier region: Afghanistan or nearby. The scabbard seems unusual also in that the suspension system is two rings mounted at the throat of the scabbard, similar to Moroccan swords and knives. I'm out of my depth trying to expain the origin of that feature. Rick's sword, as noted by Rob, resembles a kirach, with a pointed downcurved blade. Again the large false edge and partial T-spine seem unusual, and might suggest NW India. What strikes me as most obviously uncommon on this one is the hilt -- a hybrid between the Indian basket hilt and the Indo-Persian (tulwar) hilt. We saw a couple of pictures illustrating this transitional form of hilt at Timonium, and I think they were attributed to a particular period, as the fashion shifted from the older Indian basket form to the tulwar form, but again I don't recall the exact time frame. I was sitting next to Jim McDougall who was taking copious notes, so I'm sure Jim will be contributing here shortly. Ian.