Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Johan van Zyl · 28th July 2017, 10:15 AM

So true! But let me describe my own mindset in regard to our "available" threescore-and-ten plus bonus years before coming to the on-topic point of this post (and I'm saying this not for Alan specifically, but also for all the younger set): Carry on flying till the end; if you stumble, get up again; spend your days right up to the last one.

Here's a humorous incident which has some bearing on what I'm trying to say: In the public service department where I worked as a lecturer for 36 years there developed over time a habit for those on the point of retirement, to either 1) not arrive to work that day, 2) to go home after morning tea, 3) to be picked up by family after midday lunch, 4) or at the least to not make use of the shuttle vehicle, but to drive to work on your own steam.

I volunteered as driver of the shuttle for about 20 years, and it was expected that I surrender the bus the previous day of my retirement. I said no. Not only did I decide to fulfil my duty as shuttle "pilot" there & back, but it included being at work the entire day. I raised a lot of eyebrows, but they were understanding, because I was being consistent to the last. The same goes for life - carry on till the end, especially in the way you deal with friends, family and people around you.

Now before the moderator hurls me from the forum for off-topic comments, let me get on to the greneng once again. I realise that my few concise words can be misunderstood - reminds me of the speaker who was asked to give a talk of an hour's duration. He said he could do that right away. When urgently contacted to say the talk would have to be cut to ten minutes, he replied that they would have to postpone the talk as he needed a lot of time to prepare!

The greneng is one example of the incorporation of religious symbolism put into the keris. But the greneng consists of a number of elements, and I'm wondering if these elements could be seen as one "message"? Can one compare the entities as being in a relationship to one another, in the same way as the separate words in a sentence are in relationship? Could the "message" of the greneng be understood as worship? If the ron dha could be understood as a mantra symbol, could not the whole greneng be understood as a prayer?

All right, so the other elements of the greneng cannot be letters of the alphabet. But they could be stylised representations of something? Could they have been cut there as the empu's appeal to the principle god Siva? Moreover, on a single keris there are elements of symbolism to Ganesha also. But the greneng seems to be different in that the elements are arranged in line, as if they are interconnected.

Alan admits that iconography interpretation is a neglected field of research. But surely that does not mean one should not keep asking questions? Sometimes we are confronted by such a staggering accumulation of observations that we cannot see the forest for the trees. Me, I'm seeing the trees but not the forest! Perhaps this post is my way of asking whether it might be a good idea to narrow down the field a bit and make a few daring conclusions with regard to the Javanese greneng.

28th July 2017, 10:15 AM	#17
Johan van Zyl Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: I live in Gordon's Bay, a village in the Western Cape Province in South Africa. Posts: 126	So true! But let me describe my own mindset in regard to our "available" threescore-and-ten plus bonus years before coming to the on-topic point of this post (and I'm saying this not for Alan specifically, but also for all the younger set): Carry on flying till the end; if you stumble, get up again; spend your days right up to the last one. Here's a humorous incident which has some bearing on what I'm trying to say: In the public service department where I worked as a lecturer for 36 years there developed over time a habit for those on the point of retirement, to either 1) not arrive to work that day, 2) to go home after morning tea, 3) to be picked up by family after midday lunch, 4) or at the least to not make use of the shuttle vehicle, but to drive to work on your own steam. I volunteered as driver of the shuttle for about 20 years, and it was expected that I surrender the bus the previous day of my retirement. I said no. Not only did I decide to fulfil my duty as shuttle "pilot" there & back, but it included being at work the entire day. I raised a lot of eyebrows, but they were understanding, because I was being consistent to the last. The same goes for life - carry on till the end, especially in the way you deal with friends, family and people around you. Now before the moderator hurls me from the forum for off-topic comments, let me get on to the greneng once again. I realise that my few concise words can be misunderstood - reminds me of the speaker who was asked to give a talk of an hour's duration. He said he could do that right away. When urgently contacted to say the talk would have to be cut to ten minutes, he replied that they would have to postpone the talk as he needed a lot of time to prepare! The greneng is one example of the incorporation of religious symbolism put into the keris. But the greneng consists of a number of elements, and I'm wondering if these elements could be seen as one "message"? Can one compare the entities as being in a relationship to one another, in the same way as the separate words in a sentence are in relationship? Could the "message" of the greneng be understood as worship? If the ron dha could be understood as a mantra symbol, could not the whole greneng be understood as a prayer? All right, so the other elements of the greneng cannot be letters of the alphabet. But they could be stylised representations of something? Could they have been cut there as the empu's appeal to the principle god Siva? Moreover, on a single keris there are elements of symbolism to Ganesha also. But the greneng seems to be different in that the elements are arranged in line, as if they are interconnected. Alan admits that iconography interpretation is a neglected field of research. But surely that does not mean one should not keep asking questions? Sometimes we are confronted by such a staggering accumulation of observations that we cannot see the forest for the trees. Me, I'm seeing the trees but not the forest! Perhaps this post is my way of asking whether it might be a good idea to narrow down the field a bit and make a few daring conclusions with regard to the Javanese greneng.