Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

eftihis · 12th July 2007, 01:43 PM

Hi! First these are definitely cretan daggers, no doubt about it.
They are ordinary working examples, propably from the same maker.
(They have in common the "double edge" towards the point, which is unusuall). I would also say that they look a bit more modern, towards early 1900s, because of the lack of proper decoration on the metal strip between the handles. At the 1870s time, still most daggers had a scroll floral decoration engraved on this metal script. The simple "zig-zag" decoration starts latter, maybe from 1890s and then in 1920s or so we have no decaration at all, as one of the examples. Industrial revolution affected all societies, so less time was devoted to a specific knife.

Ariel, muslims and Christians in Crete had exactly the same knifes, the difference being the date, being either in islamic or gregorian callendar, according to customer request.
But of course, in battle these can change hands, and i dont think the new owner bothered so much about it!
And Crete, after many revolts become independant in 1897, and then united with Greece in 1913.
"The never really dominated by Turcs island" is generally a myth, with the exeption of the area of Sphakia in the white mountains.

To give a short summary, from the beggining of the turco-venetian war on Crete and the occupation of the west part of the island in 1645, a big part of the population became muslims. These cretan muslims reached a 40% of total population after the unsucessfull revolt of Daskaloyiannis in Sphakia in 1770.
Well, these were sort of "different kind of muslims", who continued to drink wine and eat pork, and they never even learned the turkish language exept a few words.
The muslim population started diminishing after the rbig revolution of 1821, which in Crete lasted 10 years. Especially after the 1866 revolution, many muslim villages returned to Christianity. The remaining muslim population fortified itself in cities and big villages away from the mountains, with the bigger part leaving Crete after the independance in 1897. The remaining 25.000 or so, were exhanged obligatory with Christian Greeks from Asia minor in 1924 during population exchange.
Population exchange was a solution but a tragedy as well. I will just quote an old person that described: " The "turks", left our village during population exhange. Many of them were relatives, (same surname, 3rd cousins or so,)which spoke the same language with us, had the same facial features, dance d the same dances, had the same attitude towards life, etc, and the "Greeks from Turkey" came to take their place. Yes, they were Christians, but they spoke only Turkish, have different faces , culture and dances and nobody of us wanted to talk to them, or married with them!"
See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_Muslims
and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_Turks

To go back to bichaqs, inscriptions with Christian dates are rare before 1870.

12th July 2007, 01:43 PM	#4
eftihis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chania Crete Greece Posts: 501	Hi! First these are definitely cretan daggers, no doubt about it. They are ordinary working examples, propably from the same maker. (They have in common the "double edge" towards the point, which is unusuall). I would also say that they look a bit more modern, towards early 1900s, because of the lack of proper decoration on the metal strip between the handles. At the 1870s time, still most daggers had a scroll floral decoration engraved on this metal script. The simple "zig-zag" decoration starts latter, maybe from 1890s and then in 1920s or so we have no decaration at all, as one of the examples. Industrial revolution affected all societies, so less time was devoted to a specific knife. Ariel, muslims and Christians in Crete had exactly the same knifes, the difference being the date, being either in islamic or gregorian callendar, according to customer request. But of course, in battle these can change hands, and i dont think the new owner bothered so much about it! And Crete, after many revolts become independant in 1897, and then united with Greece in 1913. "The never really dominated by Turcs island" is generally a myth, with the exeption of the area of Sphakia in the white mountains. To give a short summary, from the beggining of the turco-venetian war on Crete and the occupation of the west part of the island in 1645, a big part of the population became muslims. These cretan muslims reached a 40% of total population after the unsucessfull revolt of Daskaloyiannis in Sphakia in 1770. Well, these were sort of "different kind of muslims", who continued to drink wine and eat pork, and they never even learned the turkish language exept a few words. The muslim population started diminishing after the rbig revolution of 1821, which in Crete lasted 10 years. Especially after the 1866 revolution, many muslim villages returned to Christianity. The remaining muslim population fortified itself in cities and big villages away from the mountains, with the bigger part leaving Crete after the independance in 1897. The remaining 25.000 or so, were exhanged obligatory with Christian Greeks from Asia minor in 1924 during population exchange. Population exchange was a solution but a tragedy as well. I will just quote an old person that described: " The "turks", left our village during population exhange. Many of them were relatives, (same surname, 3rd cousins or so,)which spoke the same language with us, had the same facial features, dance d the same dances, had the same attitude towards life, etc, and the "Greeks from Turkey" came to take their place. Yes, they were Christians, but they spoke only Turkish, have different faces , culture and dances and nobody of us wanted to talk to them, or married with them!" See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_Muslims and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_Turks To go back to bichaqs, inscriptions with Christian dates are rare before 1870. Attached Images Last edited by eftihis; 12th July 2007 at 02:14 PM.