Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Mauro · 19th March 2012, 01:10 AM

Thanks Iain. I enjoyed your booklet and your efforts and I hope that some of the problems that you evidenced so clearly now will be solved in the next years. However, as any good paper it generated some questions.

Pag.9 : Origin : Early Islamic swords :
There are many similarities between these swords and the European medieval swords so that it will be difficult to establish if the influence came from the Islamic or from the European sword.

Pag. 10 Origin : Omani saif. : difficult to establish. The only similarity is the form of the blade
Pag. 13: Origins European Blades examples
2 “Second sword from Jean-Paul Cazes, wolf appears to be a locally imitation. Other mark appears genuine. Likely Solingen.” I suggest you to add the details of the marks and the reason of your statement because otherwise it is difficult to confirm it. I do not want to be misunderstood. Most probably you are right but I would like to understand which is the reason of your attribution.
3. “Third sword from Chris Topping, formerly in my own collection. Possibly a European blade but the half moons almost certainly applied locally. Likely Solingen”. Why you says the half moon was applied locally. Which evidence ? Half moon symbols are also found in European blades and , according to many authors, also copied locally but I would be able to distinguish. Do you have a key ?
Pag.14: “Similarly marked swords were held in the arsenal in Alexandria.”. Please add a reference to the arsenal. This sword is also very peculiar and much different from that more commonly found because it has a oval flattened pommel and a quite smaller guard.
Pag.14: Origins: Basic Indigenous forms.
I have never seen a Takouba without the brass handle. Is there a unique piece that connect the blade to the pommel or there are rivets ? The manufacture of the Chamba short sword, especially how the guard is blocked look more similar to the Medieval sword than the Takouba. However, this example has a curved blade and a point two characteristics difficult to encounter in takouba. I know that there are Chamba examples with straight blade but in any case it is difficult to establish who influence who.
Pag.16: Pommel Evolution.
Most probably you are right tracing this evolution looking at the characteristic of the pommel. However, because the area of diffusion of the Takouba is so large and there are many tribes is it possible that local variations of the pommel, at least in the past, were associated with different tribal groups ? At pag 40 you show a series of takouba from different tribes with different pommels and I think that also you do not dismiss this hypothesis.

Thanks again.

19th March 2012, 01:10 AM	#17
Mauro Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 83	Thanks Iain. I enjoyed your booklet and your efforts and I hope that some of the problems that you evidenced so clearly now will be solved in the next years. However, as any good paper it generated some questions. Pag.9 : Origin : Early Islamic swords : There are many similarities between these swords and the European medieval swords so that it will be difficult to establish if the influence came from the Islamic or from the European sword. Pag. 10 Origin : Omani saif. : difficult to establish. The only similarity is the form of the blade Pag. 13: Origins European Blades examples 2 “Second sword from Jean-Paul Cazes, wolf appears to be a locally imitation. Other mark appears genuine. Likely Solingen.” I suggest you to add the details of the marks and the reason of your statement because otherwise it is difficult to confirm it. I do not want to be misunderstood. Most probably you are right but I would like to understand which is the reason of your attribution. 3. “Third sword from Chris Topping, formerly in my own collection. Possibly a European blade but the half moons almost certainly applied locally. Likely Solingen”. Why you says the half moon was applied locally. Which evidence ? Half moon symbols are also found in European blades and , according to many authors, also copied locally but I would be able to distinguish. Do you have a key ? Pag.14: “Similarly marked swords were held in the arsenal in Alexandria.”. Please add a reference to the arsenal. This sword is also very peculiar and much different from that more commonly found because it has a oval flattened pommel and a quite smaller guard. Pag.14: Origins: Basic Indigenous forms. I have never seen a Takouba without the brass handle. Is there a unique piece that connect the blade to the pommel or there are rivets ? The manufacture of the Chamba short sword, especially how the guard is blocked look more similar to the Medieval sword than the Takouba. However, this example has a curved blade and a point two characteristics difficult to encounter in takouba. I know that there are Chamba examples with straight blade but in any case it is difficult to establish who influence who. Pag.16: Pommel Evolution. Most probably you are right tracing this evolution looking at the characteristic of the pommel. However, because the area of diffusion of the Takouba is so large and there are many tribes is it possible that local variations of the pommel, at least in the past, were associated with different tribal groups ? At pag 40 you show a series of takouba from different tribes with different pommels and I think that also you do not dismiss this hypothesis. Thanks again.