Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Jim McDougall · 14th April 2023, 04:24 PM

What?! an arms reference made a misteake?
Arms study is always a work in progress, and most authors I am familiar with typically add a disclaimer in their introductions that there will invariably be errors in some cases.

It seems of course that there is an innate comparison between many types of tools and weapons, and as noted earlier often one can become the other and vice versa. There may be notable influences between these as well.

As a matter of functionality, the cross bar's purpose, to prevent excessive penetration in hunting boars would serve as well on a combat weapon. Perhaps the convention on the spontoon had the same root?

By that token, could a spontoon serve as a boar hunting weapon? of course, just as Raf noted early in this discussion.

Good observation BTW Raf, on the remarkable shape of the expanded point on the boar hunt sword! that is a compelling comparison to the blade on the example in OP .

Here I would note again that there are with colonial arms (and tools for that matter), incredible numbers of variants in the examples made by blacksmiths, which of understandably are often in majority.
This is the bane of the arms researcher, trying to categorize or identify these items which are 'outside the box' visually.

Polearms and staff weapons seem to vex many (including me) with the proper terms and classifications. What separates pike from spontoon?
the halberd is easier as it has an axe type head and poll but is simply on a longer shaft instead of handle.

While we may not reach a consensus on the identification of this apparently very old piece, the possibilities remain intriguing, and the discussion here is valuable in the salient points that have come up. Thats what its all about!!

PS,
This reminds me of the flensing knife (for whaling) I posted recently, with a crescent type blade as identified in several nautical antiquities references........and was countered by identification of a virtually identical example used by leather workers.
Could these same type knives have been utilized by both? why not?

14th April 2023, 04:24 PM	#19
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,767	What?! an arms reference made a misteake? Arms study is always a work in progress, and most authors I am familiar with typically add a disclaimer in their introductions that there will invariably be errors in some cases. It seems of course that there is an innate comparison between many types of tools and weapons, and as noted earlier often one can become the other and vice versa. There may be notable influences between these as well. As a matter of functionality, the cross bar's purpose, to prevent excessive penetration in hunting boars would serve as well on a combat weapon. Perhaps the convention on the spontoon had the same root? By that token, could a spontoon serve as a boar hunting weapon? of course, just as Raf noted early in this discussion. Good observation BTW Raf, on the remarkable shape of the expanded point on the boar hunt sword! that is a compelling comparison to the blade on the example in OP . Here I would note again that there are with colonial arms (and tools for that matter), incredible numbers of variants in the examples made by blacksmiths, which of understandably are often in majority. This is the bane of the arms researcher, trying to categorize or identify these items which are 'outside the box' visually. Polearms and staff weapons seem to vex many (including me) with the proper terms and classifications. What separates pike from spontoon? the halberd is easier as it has an axe type head and poll but is simply on a longer shaft instead of handle. While we may not reach a consensus on the identification of this apparently very old piece, the possibilities remain intriguing, and the discussion here is valuable in the salient points that have come up. Thats what its all about!! PS, This reminds me of the flensing knife (for whaling) I posted recently, with a crescent type blade as identified in several nautical antiquities references........and was countered by identification of a virtually identical example used by leather workers. Could these same type knives have been utilized by both? why not? Attached Images Last edited by Jim McDougall; 14th April 2023 at 04:34 PM.